This room is limited to discussion relating to the 2014 trial of Gerard Baden-Clay
on trial for the murder of his wife, Allison Baden-Clay
Update 27/02/15
Life insurance payout for Allison Baden-Clay will go to her family, not her husband Gerard
The Courier-Mail
February 27, 2015
Allison and Gerad Baden-Clay at the time of their engagement.
SLAIN Queensland mother Allison Baden-Clay’s life insurance payout will go to a legal trust while her husband awaits the appeal of his murder conviction.
Today, the Federal Court ordered the sum of Allison’s TAL Life Limited policy — worth more than $412,000 in 2013 — be paid to the trust of solicitors representing her father, the estate’s executor.
It will be held in the trust account pending the final outcome of Gerard Baden-Clay’s pending appeal of his murder conviction.
The life insurance policy was jointly held by Allison, 43, and her husband, Gerard Baden-Clay.
It was one of two that were frozen after Baden-Clay was charged with his wife’s murder in June 2012.
Last August, funds from a Suncorp Life and Superannuation policy that was worth more than $347,000 in 2013 were ordered to be paid to Allison’s father’s representatives.
Allison’s parents, Geoff and Priscilla Dickie, are caring for the couple’s three daughters.
Baden-Clay, 44, tried to claim the insurance shortly after his wife’s body was found on a creek bank at Anstead in Brisbane’s west in April 2012.
After he was charged, the Federal Court became involved and froze the funds pending the outcome of criminal proceedings.
A former real estate agent, Baden-Clay was found guilty last July of murdering his wife at their Brookfield home in Brisbane and dumping her body.
Details of their marital breakdown, financial troubles and Baden-Clay’s infidelities were laid bare during the four-week trial.
Baden-Clay is serving a life sentence and will be eligible for parole in 2027.
General forum discussion and chat is always available here in our Lounge
Aussie Criminals and Crooks 
I though the above photo was a nice appropriate one for this room
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test today
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For anyone going to the Supreme Court, Brisbane tomorrow – it’s Court #3 on the 3rd floor – 10am
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BADEN-CLAY
Justice Applegarth
Court 3
Floor 3 10:00 AM
(Pre-Trial Hearing – Appearance and Legal Representatives Required)
I wonder if the accused will be attending “In Person”
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Thanks Mountain Misst, one thing I though of was if anyone is, and they have a twitter account I can post a live feed on the homepage directly to their feed…thanks
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News Reports to date on Carmel Ritchie’s sessions with both ABC and GBC do not appear to either help or hinder GBC’s case.
It appears that Allison was encouraged by GBC’s preparedness to attend the sessions, and GBC used them as a means of declaring his social status and conveying that he wanted to continue in the marriage, but was at the same time advising TMcH that he would soon come to her unconditionally.
This to me just demonstrates his narcissistic personality, where he tells everybody what they want to hear, as pathological liars are expert at doing.
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Too right Dan I recall Allison saw several physiologists & it was only Carmen who didn’t want to testify. So maybe there are a couple of others. GBC in his police interview at the house-said Allison saw a couple of others but she was more comfortable with this one- GBC just piddled in her pocket because I doubt he’d lower himself to listen to Allison. One volatile situation ready to explode.
I still wonder what is giving TMcH her Teflon coating. Considering she lied and kept evidence from the police etc. She worked and partied alongside the whole family, I wouldn’t be surprised if she knew where the phone ended up, bazaar but she seems to have immunity.
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At the end of the day, Carmel Ritchie appeared to give her evidence willingly and without any bias towards either party. I suspect it was the management of Relationships Australia that were behind attempts to claim exemption from giving evidence.
Re TmcH, I consider her a very self serving person, whose testimony had to be prized out of her, and who possibly still has not revealed all she knows or suspects.
I suspect that GBC alone ditched the phone early the following morning as part of his scheme to portray that she met foul play at the hands of a stranger on a morning walk the morning after.e I
While there is clear evidence GBC was contemplating Allison’s Demise, such as his inquiries as to the insurance policies, and comments to TMcH that he aould soon come to her unconditionally, there was also a massive shortfall in the detail of his plan. If someone were to be determined to pull off the “Perfect Murder”, the plan would need to be defined down to the finest detail, yet this event was so botched one can only conclude that he had not finished his planning, when tempers flared, and he acted way ahead of schedule, and struggled to make it appear he was not involved in any way.
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There were the co-workers who have stated Toni M wasn’t able to function after leaving GBC business. Her sales were very low if any and she had a terrible temper with anyone suggesting she should forget him and move on. TM seemed to be far less upset about the other two affairs he had than him telling her he needed to work on his marriage. Seems her temper worked on GBC like his temper did on poor Allison. Leaving her feeling useless unattractive and unwanted. Who wouldn’t be depressed being treated by your spouse as if you were non-existent.
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Agree that this chaotic homicide hasn’t the smoothness of a well premeditated murder that I suspect the perpetrator had intended. Though it doesn’t mean he hadn’t decided to knock her off that night. Suggest that Toni had enough of defferals and expected no Allison at the confrence the next day or she’d reveal all, including their emails. That would hasten the planned elimination of Allison. I’d strongly suggest that Toni was involved in a premeditated murder plan for Allison and may have had assisted in areas of concealment of evidence.
I can’t grasp how the girls were all out and stayed out for the count so early and solidly for the entiere night while locals, dogs etc., hear screams thumps, body dragged around, abscence in drive offs and not ine single kid stirred or heard a thing.Seems they’d been given a good dose mixed in something to knock them out before hand.Unfortunately it seems Allison was the kind of mum who had a veritable kiddie home pharmacy for any ailment kids could have. So many kid’s meds have antihistamine sedatives in them.
The kids last understanding of that night of mum and dad friendly fits his buttering up Allison to accept a drnk or too.
Allison having a good dose of alchohol in her system is more likely a result of being conned into a drink or two spiked with extra vodka. So once dozing off, as hoped an attempt to strangle her was made. Except she woke to fight back, hence the resultant chaos, blood etc..
She also probably took a bit long to doze off leaving a far lesser time line to be disposed off and not as knocked out as hoped with alcholol wearing down.
It’s unlikely with being in zoloft and facing a conference early she’d drink too much alchohol knowingly.
He’d not want to dope her up with a drug she didn’t take once her body got found, toxicology analysis a problem. He’d be hoping it wouldn’t be discovered too soon, but not too far away allowing his re insurance claims.
Suspect he’d hoped a non bloody strangling done by 8.30pm and have her dropped off more remotely where it could sound plausible she fell by accident or on purpose to her death and not found for a month or two so decomposed further that ligature marks weren’t present.
What’s very weird is that Gerard called the police so early to report Allison missing. When ones worried about someone not being back as expected quite early in the piece your first inquiry may be to the police around have they heard of anyone hit by a car taken to hospital in bad enough state that they couldn’t call home. The next point of call is hospitals to see if anyone like his wife had been recently admitted from some fall or collapse via other persons,
Even more weird is the police responding so rapidly to an adult non endangered missing person who walked on a short safe route and not seen on it when last checked. Plus not even possibly missing by more than 40 minutes.
What had the police been told before to be so readily alerted over Allison? Especially to takeit so seriouisly?
Furthermore, what was it that frightened Gerard to make a report so soon.???
What did Gerard need to guard against that was worse than facing cops with a clawed up face and blood soaked car, plus from then on probably limited from removing further incriminating evidence?
He couldn’t be blamed for sitting on an Allison abscence for over a week. Could claim since she seemed happier lately thought maybe she’d found another option and went to get it going. He could claim presumably because topic of Toni raised by the confrence gave away he hadn’t got over Toni enough might have got Allison to act.
Since he’d had secrets he thought she may finally had embarked on secrets too. Also whatever it could be, he didn’t want to risk exposing their family to scandals that may blow over soon.
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Purely speculation re answers to my prior questions above:
The fact that Gerard’s family are standing by him to the extent they have been implies they consider someone else to be extremely culpable in the premeditation and coercing Gerard to be drawn into the commital of the murder of Allison.
They are overall relatively decent folk who while disaproving of the murder, may well know first hand their son’s suseptabilities, escapist ways of dealing with stresses etc., and how he could be mis- led, cajoled, threatened and manipulated to get there.
It may well be Toni was the instigator, the driver of the acts and even had some part in concealment of evidence early on.
The problem is the impracticality of sharing the blame or even making Toni a persistent instigator can’t avoid jail time for Gerard. His best bet is to hope any gaps in solid evidence fail in prosecution, claim not guilty and no comment.
The prosecution want to get the prime physical actor, so don’t care about Toni’s role if she plays their way.
The fact the police swooped at the first mention of Allison gone is like they’d been already been told via convincing heresay from a source who knew what Toni was working on to be made reality. As convincing such information could sound, it would’ve had too large gaps re evidence and possibly demands of total anonimity tied in with it to act on earlier.
I’d watch Olivia to reveal the version of how her brother got taken down if convicted and appeals fail.
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If Olivia has something to reveal, she should have done so long before now, imo
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Dysfunctional families….
It’s no accident that GBC is the way he is, all the family are just like him. They raised him don’t forget.
It seems all their financials & assets were a part of a family company/family trust of the BC’s. It’s typical of the working class/corporate men in family disputes to plan a long term plan of hiding assets & money with their family so when they leave you’re left with crippling debt and relying on legal aid to fund a divorce & child custody arrangements that sees you royally shafted.
I volunteer at a women’s domestic violence recourse center where I help write court docs in family law matters. So many women just like Alison seek help with the aftermath of the end of a relationship with a sociopath/narcissists and their dysfunctional family which is assisting them. They’ve been worn down over a long period of time, broke, dazed, in shock and terrified of losing their children to a man who has advised them they are seeking full custody of.
They’re not just going into the battle against their perpetrator, but also the perp’s family. The perp & their family claim to the court that you’re mentally ill or unhinged (they made you that way with their unacceptable treatment of you, crazy making is one of the perp tactics used) and seek the greatest share of access to the children on the grounds they are the better parent & you’re unhinged. They don’t actually want the children, they just don’t want YOU to have them and to avoid paying you child support. They want full control of you despite leaving you. Control the kids = control you!
I suspect that Alison found out the affair was continuing and has advised GBC that the marriage was over before he’s had the chance to move all the family assets & finances over to a family company/family trust held by the BC’s. I suspect Alison was going to confront TMcH at the conference.
When you stand up for yourself and take the upper hand with these types of men, the first 48 hours that you’ve taken that stance is the most dangerous period for you. The risk of assault or death by these types of controlling men once you’ve taken a stance is incredibly high.
I’ve lost count how many times I’ve had to deliver a ‘Your husband/partner has more than likely been planning his exit for well over a year’ and I’ve lost count of how many men just like GBC I’ve encountered in court who have planned their action for well over a year and have left a wife/partner with nothing and struggling to comprehend that their life all this time has been a lie supported by this man’s family.
This murder trial is only the first battle for the BC’s, if they don’t think the ATO is combing through their financial history now, they have another huge shock coming from the ATO.
People always get what they deserve in the end.
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Brigette, I thought so many of the things you have just written about,,, not so well premeditated especially (I think he planned to do it soon but not that night) and the fact that he made the call so early when he had so many injuries already. He had already told Toni, it was ending soon and she was quite irate at him upon discovering Allison at the conference. He had come to an unexpected impasse re the conference. There was a tip of a glove inside the jumper at autopsy, which I wonder if anyone even DNA tested, can’t find the info. I think he put on the gloves, he texted Allison from the bedroom, that’s why there are text to her that evening, something like seduction or wanting to make things better after their talk, (show her how much he loved her and not Toni who he had just informed her would be there tomorrow maybe?)…then he smothered her with her jumper either when she fell asleep or there and then. Allison got the two screams in, the first at the surprise attack from behind as the jumper was lifted upward over her head and he began to smother her, which is when she managed to reach backwards and scratch him. Then the second as she used the lower half of her body to change positions, perhaps dropped to the floor from the couch or the bed…until GBC managed to get his body weight on top of her. This is where he sustained the contusions to his upper torso and possibly neck as Allison’s occiput flayed up and down and back and forward whilst he pressed his body weight against her head until she stopped struggling. The linear lines on the contusions look like the sharp lines where he pressed the ribs against her occiput. She also had possible haematoma on her rib cage and leg of the same side. This may have been where her own arm and leg were trapped underneath her, with his full strength and body weight on top of her. Allison was no lean woman either she would have been difficult to carry so he probably carried her over his shoulder. .Allison got hold of his finger through the jumper and the gloves but only managed to keep the tip of the glove between her teeth (chipped tooth). The tip of the glove was found well inside the jumper wrapped around her head. I think that GBC took the gloves off after the struggle and didn’t notice the missing tip when he took them off inside out. You would think a forensic officer would notice the tip of the glove missing at the crime scene and be most concerned for themselves. So maybe Allison woke up in the back of the car or was clearly not deceased and he smashed her head where we see all the blood, otherwise there would have been more blood evidence at the crime scene at the house. The botanical evidence in Allison’s hair was likely due to the way he carried her through the garden. He kept the jumper over her face because he just couldn’t bear the thought of looking at what he had done and he placed her under a spot that is linked to a Scout Camp in a shelter where she was ‘protected’ and would be found, so that his daughters could grieve and the tiny little part of him that felt compassion for her could feel better. Perpetrators that are close to the victim often place the victims in places or positions where they are ‘cared’ for. He also placed her on her side in a sleeping position ie not undignified. He was having a very big conflict indeed that night and morning.
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Very explicit details, thanks for your kindness to Allison and her family! Amituofo!
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I agree with you totally regarding TMcH, I wonder how much was privately discussed between TMcH and GBC, regarding the lead up and post event. I suspect that TMcH knows so much more than she is ready to divulge. She wouldn’t like the consequences if she spoke the truth.
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Sorry for long message but …. Totally agree.
I am particularly fascinated in this case because I have a former husband and in-laws who have frightening parallel with the BC’s. Mine assured me for months after separating and whilst attending marriage counselling that he wanted to reconcile, he even talked about aiming for a family trip to Disneyland (land of fairytales… How appropriate) all the while as he planned on fleecing me in cahoots with his parents and getting possession of our chattels and belongings while I trusted him. He also started trying to paint me as mentally unstable and told our counsellor that 90% of our marriage problems were due to my “depression” … diagnosed by him and contradictory to 2 doctors who told me I did not have it. All part of this Narcissistic/Psychopathic personality. GBC would have been ‘gaslighting’ Allison through the whole marriage – and forget anti-malaria tablets … he was the cause of her depression ! All whilst he played the perfect, dutiful irreplaceable husband. They are chameleons with no soul and no conscience, that’s how they can lie and live with their lives by the hour. There are statistically 230,000 GBC’s in the Australian population. They are at our workplace, in our extended families, living next door .. and as an EX real estate agent, I can honestly say there is a higher percentage of them in the industry as it attracts Narcissistic, lying characters. When I first heard there was a Qld real estate agents wife missing, the first thing I thought of was a) infidelity b) financial troubles c)psychopathic wife killer. Not surprised at all as I met many GBC types in my brief time in that shallow industry.
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What has happened to this web page ???
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Hi Bryzza, Thanks for popping in, do you mean how quiet it is? Well after the 2 day hearing the other week we are really waiting for the trial in the middle of the year. Some folks come and go, some have chosen to leave, that sort of thing happens. If you enjoyed chatting to the old crew of regulars, some have moved on to create their own site.
Cheers, Robbo
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Got a mate that clocked him 16th March late morning 11 am ish at the bridge on the phone , Mate thought it a bit sus as an upmarket prado would have sat nav and hands free all of you would think the cops could pinpoint to a certain time and place I E Kholo Creek Bridge late morning 16/03/2012 phone and vehicle location.
Mate can confirm location and time because of appointment in Ipswich and knows the accused but does not wish to talk to the police as he has a motorcycle history.
This happened one month prior to Allison going missing, Interesting I think a lot more will come out at the trial.
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Hi Bryzza,
It is very interesting that GBC was seen stopped at the Kolo Bridge a month before Allison was dumped there, It would be very interesting to determine who he was talking to, perhaps it was a Big Game Hunter. There are other indicators of pre planning, such as calls to the Live Assurance Companies re the Value of the Policies, but this is a very sinister link.
What would it take to get your friend to go to the Qld Police with the info, Surely doing so would only improve his relationship with the Law.
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Thanks for sharing that Bryzza. Very interesting stuff.
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Hi bryzza, the information your friend has sounds like a crucial part in demonstrating pre-planning, please urge him to make a statement asap. It will be a terrible miscarriage of justice if GBC gets off because people who hold vital information do not share it, for whatever reason.
If he was murdered, would he not appreciate it if someone testified to what they saw, to help bring his killer to justice? Allison can no longer speak for herself – she needs the voices of those who can contribute – like your friend!
In any case, I believe what goes around comes around, so the good Kharma from doing the right thing by Allison will come back to your friend.
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There is a court date next Monday 24th Feb in the lead up to the murder trial. It is for “recording of evidence” so I guess that means lawyers shuffling papers back and forth in front of the magistrate.
I reckon his nibs would not be required to attend, but then what would I know about such things.
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I would expect GBC would be dissappointed at not needing to attend, the only outings he will get over the next couple of decades will be his court appearances, and once the trial is over, he will have a very long wait before he experiences any open spaces.
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Dan, I agree with your comments on February 8, 2014 at 8:16 am about how it happened – ie partially pre-planned and then things got out of hand a lot sooner and he lost it. Spot on I’d say. The man was full of hate and anger, but cold as ice along with it. Met him once, many years earlier, he chilled me to the bone. His eyes, there was nothing there but coldness.
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Hi ITV, Your observations of GBC are interesting. It seems that the coldness in his eyes was very significant.
May I ask if your meeting with him was social or business, and whether there was any conflict between your respective positions on the matter.
It seems odd that his coldness should be so evident that you recall such so vividly.
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There was no conflict between me and GBC, he would barely remember me if it all, I had little interaction with him other than general introductions at a business breakfast with other people around. But I actualy thought to myself -“That guy’s a wife murderer” his presence felt so evil. Little did I know what would happen years later. Weird but true.
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GBC has that voice that appears so soft quiet timid one moment and overly friendly/dramatic the next to suit every situation. Total passive-aggressive behaviour specifically to induce his self gratification. When angered/quick tempered his looks could likely slice you sideways. Or he would simply cry. Which he did several times in meetings when things weren’t going his way according to co-worker LE docs.
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There is another scheduled court hearing soon. His lawyers are playing hardball with potential jurors.
Lost in the Morcombe/scumbag Cowan verdict yesterday was a pretrial hearing for GBC.
But the jury selection process was not the only pre-trial skirmish yesterday between the prosecution and GBC’s lawyers..
His lawyers want all evidence suppressed in the media during the trial. They don’t want the media to have the access to exhibits that could be published broadcast…
“The court was told lawyers for Baden-Clay intended to oppose any media applications to access exhibits for publication.”
So much for a man who is “innocent” and “has nothing to hide”. What happened to Business-As-Usual ?!!
He doesn’t want Australia to see the evidence… odd that… wonder if he will take the stand (I predict he won’t, just like his pal and future neighbour Brett Cowan chose not to give evidence himself. His lawyers aren’t stupid. They know he is his own worst enemy and is an incredibly bad liar)
It is imperative, of absolutely crucial importance, that we get people into the actual trial on a day by day basis, so we can let Australia know what is going on.
The actual trial date has been listed for June 10 !!! (At last people, after all this time… it’s just around the corner… and the corner after that.)
http://www.news.com.au/national/queensland/allison-badenclay-murder-trial-jurors-may-be-polled-to-detect-bias-against-accused-husband-gerard-badenclay/story-fnii5v6w-1226854192676
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Hi JJE,
Given the complex mix of mostly significant counter arguments surrounding multiple reports of a Blue Car and it’s links to known pedophile Douglas Jackway, together with very little circumstantial evidence and absolutely no forensic evidence linking Cowan, but that still resulted in a Guilty Verdict, GBC and his Legal Team must be paranoid about their chances of getting an acquittal.
There is so much more forensic and circumstantial evidence than was available against Cowan !. I wonder if the two will ever get to share a Cell in the Big House ?
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The matriarch turns seventy this month. I guess #1 son will miss the ‘knees up’. What a shame.
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This time next month GBC will be in the dock listening to how his plot unraveled in his murder trial…Cannot come quick enough folks. Hope you all join in.I’m working on a special separate page to cover the trial that I will post live when the start of the trial actually happens. Cheers
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Supreme Court, Criminal Sittings :
Baden-Clay Trial… Tuesday 10th June at 10am – 5th floor Court #11 Justice Byrne
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Cheers, MM. I hope somebody can give us inside information during the trial. Can’t get there myself, more’s the pity.
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Here’s my astro spin on things in relation to the trial before it starts:
http://wp.me/p2Cfe3-2py
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Well the day has finally arrived. It’s bloody here at last. I have been patient (we all have), but I cannot believe it’s finally the day where we start to get to the bottom of this saga. It’s almost surreal. There are many questions to answer and blanks to fill in. I hope Mr Business-As-Usual can shed some light on a certain sequence of events and the circumstances leading up to it – but we are probably going to get a sales-pitch from him: not answers. I am postive others can enlighten us should he choose to stick to the “married-mum-of-three-goes-out-and-kills-herself-by-walking-16km-to-Kholo-bridge-and-O.D.ing” nonsense. Like Poirot says, all will be revealed. Well bloody reveal all I say, let everyone see for themselves… especially the jury.
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I have also been pondering whether GBC will take to the stand during the trial. He doesn’t have to. Scumbag Cowan chose not to (meaning his lawyers). GBC may be a pretty thick plank but his lawyers, especially Mr Shields, are not stupid (he is an ex-cop QLD cop and detective of 25 years). They know their client is a self destructive hazard in front of a camera or an audience. They know he specializes in shooting himself in the foot. What they are really worried is that he will blast himself in the head should he take the witness box – a self inflicted fatal wound… I mean think about it; that farcical, comical channel 9 interview “I’m a little bit hurt but I’m ok” outside Skull Manor, the intentional, staged car crash into the bus terminal at Indooroopilly that preceded that interview, the ridiculous behaviour of him and his dysfunctional family, the transcripts of his recorded police interviews with all his “umming” and “ahhing”…. I have said it before and I’ll bloody well say it again. This man is a blazing wagon of gunpowder waiting to explode… What his lawyers will do with this unpredicatble clown intrigues me very much… how will they deal with such a ridiculous, volatile client? We still don’t know why Dazza, his previous lawyer, dropped him like a black snake in a sleeping bag.
P.S. Do we know whose car is was that GBC stacked into the bus terminal on purpose ? I still have not figured that out.
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I think his name is Paul or Peter cannot recall last name just read it yesterday though. Surname starts with a ‘C’ I’m sure. He was the personal friend who gave GBC money for his business near the end. I whole ‘I need to have abrasions on my body to go with my facial scratches other superficial cuts I already have’ strategy didn’t work like he planned thankfully. Just like lying to the Dr he went to very next day after Allison missing telling Dr that LE asked him to have his ‘razor cuts’ checked by a Dr story. When she wouldn’t agree to say they were from a razor; instead stated they looked like fingernail scratches- he went to a second Dr. Later the LE stated they did not ask him to go to a Dr. Oops again!!
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Sorry for mis-spell. I wrote ‘I’ instead ‘The’ before the word ‘whole’. It’s been a long day. Cheers
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Good morning all. The year has flown, but weirdly not the countdown to this trial.A long time coming. I wish we had the live trials like the USA…Anyway, may justice be served.
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Choosing jury at the moment, I have embeded a twitter feed from those in court on the main page which is up to the second, as they sit inside.
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Hey folks I made a few changes to the 1st day of trial thread (http://aussiecriminals.com.au/gerard-baden-clay-trial/day-1/) so I get it right for the whole trial. I will start with the beginning of the day and time-stamp each update throughout the day underneath, so we can all read what happened from start to finish (and anywhere in between with the times highlighted)
Also for ease of reading and smoothness, any photo, video or audio evidence released will be posted at bottom of each days thread!
I hope you hang around and follow what should be an interesting trial
Robbo
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Second day kicking off 10am folks
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mmm bit dead here go the daily trial pages, which are stickied to the current day
http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2014/06/10/gerard-baden-clay-trial-day-1/
http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2014/06/11/gerard-baden-clay-trial-day-2/
http://aussiecriminals.com.au/2014/06/12/gerard-baden-clay-trial-day-3/
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Thanks, Robbo and well done ! We’re very lucky to have this, our own Aussie site. And this site is looking GOOD ! You’ve put in so much effort and it’s brilliantly presented and updated. Hope people remember to return here. It’s been a long time to wait and so much has happened in all our lives during the past two years. I suppose a lot of people have forgotten about or don’t have time to think about Allison and GBC due to their own problems, but I hope as the trial continues many of our old mates will find their way back to Aussie Crims and Crooks
Thanks too, to all those who kept the faith all through the past two years and who continued to post here
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Thanks Burleigh, I appreciate that, but the community that contribute are the ones who keep the place going, otherwise Id be writing to myself.
I always welcome back anyone, as you say I hope some fantastic people who really were affected by Allisons case do comeback to where it all started. best bit is Im not going anywhere so if and when they do I will still be here plugging away, no silly grudges etc.
have a good day BB
Rob
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Never in all my years have I seen or experienced shaving cut’s like GBC’s. He’s a grown man with pretty thick facial hair so should know how to shave properly. Unless someone can testify that he walks around with cuts like that on his face on a regular basis, he’s lying through his teeth.
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While I was writing up on this case I noticed that little brother in Canada had an interesting astrology chart – was lit up like a Xmas tree. Thought – hmmm he’s going to be here to support the family, until I had a closer look. I’m now of the opinion that Nigelaine are both rapidly deteriorating emotionally and Adam is attempting to direct via Skype…
If you want to see the extra charts of the family I’m in the process of generating them one by one – http://wp.me/P2Cfe3-2rY
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Thanks, Mountain Misst, very interesting and looking forward to the continuation of your analysis. Yes, raised and fostered via siege mentality or as you say, ‘Them vs us’. Stormed to the front (to my mind) during the infantile (imo) ‘cowboys and Indians’ behaviour of OW when she galloped across the yards and down the neighbour’s side passage in aid of Gerbil when the media were after him
I see it as arrested development as result of (a) genetics and (b) familial programming. None of them are ‘normal’ in my opinion, although I know next to nothing about the ‘other’ son so who knows, he could be the white-sheep of the family
So much to lose must be their overweening obsession. And all resulting from the obsession with that name ! That name’s driven the paths of their lives and dictates the lives of all those others with solid and tenuous links to it. So many of them out there around the world just hanging on this trial and what it will do to their social standing via that name, which was once considered a social blessing and may – pending the outcome of this trial – become their downfall
Lesson: earn your own glory instead of clinging to tattered laurels
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I love your chart readings ! Do you do private ones ? ! I am dealing with my own personal GBC at the moment and could do with some help LOL !
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Judgejuryexexecutioner wrote (here on the 10th I think) : quote: We still don’t know why Dazza, his previous lawyer, dropped him like a black snake in a sleeping bag end quote. LOL. I can’t remember that at the moment but would love to hear more
Also, I’m searching to find a post I read here on the site somewhere. I read it about an hour ago, but I think it was a few days old – about GBC’s legal team fighting to keep court exhibits away from the media. Anyone know anything about that or have opinions re: same ? I didn’t know anyone had the power or right to withhold evidence from the media or public. The public’s paying for all this. The court is a public machine, isn’t it? A criminal is tried by the court on behalf of the people (isn’t that right, regardless of how it’s worded?). Therefore, anything tendered as evidence in court becomes court, i.e., public, knowledge and property – for posterity? Isn’t that right?
I’d love to know more about all the above if/when anyone has the time
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After 2 years of interpreting this family’s dirty laundry, I’ve come to the conclusion that Nigel as 2nd born son wasn’t as bright as his elder brother. Big Bro got a university education, whereas all Nige could really come up with – was ‘a salesman’. He’s hustled and bustled his way through life and I think “Jared”/GBC is no brighter when it comes to intellect. He’s another hustler; operating on cunning.
We only have to look at how he failed to become a CPA, changed jobs after failing at Flight Centre – selling plane tickets, then sat on his bumpsadaisy while everyone else ran the real-estate business. He couldn’t even do the C21 books (hired an accountant) and he had an accounting degree!!! The accused was looking for a free ticket to ride and like so many lazy partners, riding on the shirt tails of their partner.
This also explains the need for extra-marital affairs – restores his sense of manhood yes, but worst of all – it is projection of blame for his inadequacies as a provider onto his partner and that muddled neurosis supposedly drove him from the nest.
But back to Nigel – look at what he swore in court last Thursday – all he did was bang in the ‘for sale’ signs and watered the garden… That’s probably the truth. He’s arrogant for sure and pushy as all hell being a salesman sort, but not long on brains I wouldn’t think. He would have been a drain on the coffers.
While I’m on my rant –
From a life of observation of those whom are ‘perceived-to-be’ upper class colonials and also from my own academic outlook – ‘upper class’ was an invention by the ‘middle class’ as a motivation for those less ‘well off’ to excel. Good intentions but a disastrous outcome. History tells us that prior to this good idea, there was just ‘the aristocracy’ segregated from ‘the people’.
Anyway in relation to this B-C family, I’ve come to the conclusion that – as it is with any convert (e.g. ex smoker etc) – it is the newly converted, whom makes the most trouble. In the Clay family it was Elaine. She’d climbed the ladder beyond her station and was now up her a***se. She is the one whom instigated the siege mentality; – us v them.
😉 😉 There that feels better now…
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Haha —- love your posts, Mountain Misst. You get your teeth into things and fire from the hip, just like real-life conversation
Thing I’ve noted re: the real upper-crust is that they don’t seem to give a damn. And looking at it from their point of view, why would they? We’re the great unwashed in their eyes. So why would they care about our opinion, even though we make up the 98/99%. They’re answerable only to themselves as far as they’re concerned and do as they please. They take care of their own and their own take care of them. They’re pretty well untouchable, have old-money and live in a different dimension to the vast majority
The fact the BCs are so desperate to attach to the real upper-crust betrays their awareness they don’t belong there. Nor will they accept they belong to the 98/99% ‘common herd’ as we’re known. So they’ve locked themselves in No-Man’s Land — neither fish nor fowl, neither here nor there. It must be very lonely, hence the siege mentality and the Us vs Them. They do not want to be seen to be members of the common herd. Yet they’re so common, lol — as the Pash demonstrates, as the ‘Bwana’ rego plate projects, as the addition of ‘Baden’ attests. Crazy really, because Baden was a Christian name, as you’d know, i.e., Baden Powell being the equivalent of say, Jack Spratt. On the death of Baden, his widow changed the family surname to include his Christian name. So for example, Louise Powell’s name changed to Louise Baden Powell. And if Jack Spratt’s widow had done the same, her son’s name would have altered from John Spratt to John Jack Spratt. It was eccentric from the outset. It was an odd thing to do. And oddness seems to be a hallmark of that family ever since or perhaps it always was
Now, in the stand before us, we have Nigel Baden Clay. Nigel’s original name — the one under which he was Christened, was plain old Nigel Clay. Clay was his father’s surname and it should have been sufficient imo. But clearly it wasn’t prestigious enough for the likes of its bearer. It didn’t show him to be connected to the name made famous in the scouting world, i.e., Baden Powell. Would Nigel Clay have changed his name to Nigel Powell if it hadn’t been equally nondescript? Millions of people bearing the surname Powell, worldwide. Powell is pretty ordinary as a surname. It wouldn’t have promised that certain cache to the BC clan. But Baden — well, that was a different matter. Far less common and ordinary than either Clay or Powell. And of course, back in the 1940s, most people would have connected Baden with the then prestigious and popular scouting movement. So Nigel legally changed his name and that of his descendants to Baden-Clay. It still sounds odd. People are familiar with Baden Powell, the scouts’ founder, not any Baden-Clay. The only other alternative would have been Nigel Baden Powell Clay. But wise heads might have suggested this was more than a tad desperate and pretentious. So is Baden-Clay, in my opinion
The 21st Century real-estate blurb made much of the Baden-Clay’s connections to Baden Powell of scouting fame. Striving to be more, better than, the common-herd. ‘Look at us. We have a connection with fame and glory. We’ve done nothing to merit fame and glory of our own, but by our name alone, you of the common-herd must recognise our tenuous claim to superiority’ ? And it’s true it worked on some to a degree. It must have opened some doors, resulted in occasional fawning and social climbing by those who associate famous names with money, influence and a chance to elevate themselves
I agree with your summation of members of the BC clan, and then some. In the final analysis, attempts to elevate oneself via ostentation and ‘famous’ connections, no matter how threadbare, are qualities attributed to ‘commoners’, to the working-class, the nobodies. That’s all the inclusion of Baden achieved; it revealed the sense of personal failure, ordinariness and ambition which motivated that fateful change of name. Would the world’s spotlight be on the BCs right now if their surname had been Jones? Probably not. It’s been said many times in this and other fora, ‘Why is so much media attention paid to this particular murder?’. The people who ask that aren’t trying to minimise what happened to Allison, of course. And their questions are valid. A woman was murdered in Brisbane at around the same time as Allison. Many of us discussed it briefly. Yet I can’t remember the victim’s name or any details now, whilst at the same time, Jerred still makes the headlines. Maybe, late in life and in the day, NBC regrets his social-climbing, name-change decision of back then. Maybe he wishes he and his descendants had settled for Clay, plain old Clay
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Yep… am following along. There’s lots of underlying stuff going on re this case with the 4th estate and money. The coverage goes global – the UK because it involves the modern peerage (not the aristocracy), plus the scouting movement hooks into a few hundred thousand more readers. There are layers upon layers going on psychologically – all sells advertising.
All that is apart from the outrage of women and the Allison effect – a former Miss Brisbane…
But I digress… I’d like to add a little at this point re Nigel Clay. I’ll address in astrology terms, as that is the belief system that MM chooses to speak through:
In my post on the trial in relation to the judge versus the dock, I opened with –
“An Aries Moon in a natal chart always waves a red flag in forensic astrology cases. It’s indicative of someone whom puts themselves above all else in their drive to succeed; numero uno. Be it the centre of attention of a narcissist, or someone whom is top of the tree in their field of endeavour, we note recurrence of an Aries Moon in the horoscopes of many successful people.”
I went on to discuss the judge, whom has an Aries Moon in his natal chart.
Nigel Clay was also born with an Aries Moon, however he didn’t have ‘it’ to succeed and so he chose arrogance/ narcissism or whatever you would like to call it. IMO that’s also why he latched onto the Baden tag – it was an avenue to success without any effort. Basically it’s laziness, looking for the easy path through life and easy money. I see it time and time again in the forensic cases that pass through my line-of-sight. Apathy and fear.
That aside, I had to laugh when Nigel took to the stand and immediately challenged re the pronunciation of his son’s name. Apart from a ploy to throw the prosecutor off his guard, it was an indirect challenge to the bench for authority from his Aries Moon position (driving need to be number one). Stupid idiot – he was challenging a genuine Aries Moon and the judge will not let that pass unnoticed, be assured of that.
Can just see it… Note to self: add an extra year to sentence. 😉
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Problem for me is (and always has been) ambivalence. So I can appreciate that correcting the pronunciation of Jerred’s name smacked of (and may well have been) the old man’s attempt to wrest back some control. After all, it must have been humiliating to be in that position, and to be focus of all eyes for the wrong reasons
Simultaneously, I pitied him, because it seemed also that the old man might have been attempting to correct public belief that his son had a ‘posh’ name — i.e., GerARD. I thought that in his ham-fisted way, the old man might have been trying to humanise his son and say, ‘Let’s get this straight at the start. It’s not GerARD. It’s just plain old Jerred ‘.
Actually, despite ALL my criticisms, I do pity them, all of them, even Jerred. It’s a tough world and anything that can make things a little easier is eagerly grasped, at least by most of us. It’s the reason parents push their kids at sports and academically. It’s the reason people volunteer, very often (for example, the women at our local St. Vinnies get first grabs at all donations. If they don’t personally want things, their kids and grandkids do and it keeps many families afloat). It’s the reason work-references used to be so prized and treasured. And so on. Those on the fringes of a once admired family-name must feel short-changed when they don’t inherit THE prized moniker, so they change their name to include those valuable letter arrangements. Then, in business, they hope that name will result in greater patronage which in turn translates to larger income and access to those with influence. Those who buy a business often retain it’s original name, rather than their own. Jerred donated to a particular political party, for example, in the hope it would lead to bigger things
Then we look at the family in the headlights as result of a murder accusation. So many lives stand to be adversely affected. We’ve seen how other families in the same position have come out fighting in defence not only of the accused member but also of the family name, family reputation, jobs, careers, children who stand to be badly affected if the accused is found guilty. It puts pressure on all family members, tars them all with the same brush very often. This results in defensiveness, paranoia, even suicide in some cases
It’s easy to become angry and to vent it in online fora. And if we express sympathy, it’s often interpreted as ‘being on the accused’s side’, when in fact we’re not – all we’re doing is being human. But if we’re honest, most of us must feel sorry for the BC clan and the mistresses to some degree. There but for the grace of God, etc.. They’re locked into it now. Their actions and words have truly placed them beyond the pale, whether or not they participated in the crime in the headlines. We want justice for Allison. What was done to her and the way her remains have been exposed to the world is heartbreaking and I can’t see any way her daughters can be protected from it in the future. It was all so unnecessary – we can see that from where we sit. Yet a man stands accused of Allison’s murder and if not him — then who? Even his family must see that’s the big question
What can be held responsible? Pressures. Mid-life crises. Financial pressures. The dream of a new, uncomplicated start. A wish to run from the many pressures inherent in being married, of being a father and provider, of living up to parental ambitions, etc. Pressures. I wouldn’t have wanted to be in GBC’s shoes. Wouldn’t have wanted to be in Allison’s or her children’s shoes. Wouldn’t have wanted to be one of GBC’s girlfriends or employees or partners, etc.
GBC just wasn’t up to it. Couldn’t make unrealistic dreams and ambitions become reality. And time was running out. Nothing to fall back on. No-one left to cadge from. Too late to make a fresh start without a miracle. The taste of failure and ash on the tongue, regardless of the flashy new cars. The parents did what they could but it was all crumbling, all those ambitions and dreams. Having to face personal and family mediocrity. Then a woman was murdered and disposed of. The desperate charade. So much desperation. Then the unthinkable — court, publicity, everything laid bare. Public hatred, rage. And the poor Dickies and poor little girls. And Allison — the true achiever — exposed in death yet so private in life. It’s a horror story, not to mention all those worldwide whose own standing in society relies so much on that blasted name — all of them aghast and terrified
Ironically, all those boy scouts exhortations to be honest and true, to do the right thing, to tell the truth and shame the devil. That’s how that name gained prominence. Yet in the final boil-up, GBC isn’t coming across as any sort of scout worthy of the name. Asking for too much, probably, that some of those scouts’ ideals might thrust out of some so keen to carry that name and put this business to a swift and honest end
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BB, I am a bit behind the 8 ball because I have only just read your post from the 14th but I am giving you a round of applause. You do such a mighty fine job of articulating/expressing/describing what many others might be trying to get their head around to speak out and for Allison. You have a gift there and I always enjoy reading each and every word you share. Thank you.
It is ironic that some people have done their best to denigrate, belittle and trash Allison and yet she stood head and shoulders above her husband, outlaws and the mistresses. Yes, they could have learned much from Allison’s example. Collectively, and without intention on her behalf, I think they were all jolly well intimidated by her.
Appalling to think that TMcH was a teacher, especially given her poor language skills, both grammar and spelling etc.
BB, you mentioned about Gerred wanting a fresh and uncomplicated new start….I think it is another family trait… I wonder how soon before a move did Nigel change the family name (maybe it didn’t precede a move)… Almost like a new identity to introduce yourself with. ‘Let’s not dredge up the past’ could be a family motto.
And yes BB, I feel some pity for them but even more so for those who have destroyed when they have got in the way of building their false lives.
Could someone help me out in understanding why Gerred doesn’t have to take the stand, please. Say if the killer acted alone, then there are only 2 people who know exactly what happened on that fateful night and given that one of those two is now deceased, and the other one ain’t talking, is there a real possibility that details will never be known.
Apologies for this long waffle but I can’t stop ‘the need to know’ and to see the murderer duly punished
(BB, I don’t want to sound like not only do I worship you, but have started to emulate your habits….. I left the full stop off in that last paragraph, cos I reckon it is cool how you do that :-))))))
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GBc planned on raising their daughters like he was raised and was quite frustrated with what he perceived as Allison’s lack of discipline. A co-worker stated in LE docs that GBC had hand gestures that the girls knew to obey without their father speaking. He had witnessed this. That the girls were abnormally quiet around him and that GBC had admitted to ‘belting’ them for discipline.
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I remember when that came out, Moonraker. Fate moves in mysterious ways. Out of bad comes good, sometimes. At least now, Allison’s girls have been separated from their father and live with their grandparents whose gentle, decent ways produced Allison who believed in raising her children in love, not fear
(and hopefully, GBC will get as much discipline as he can handle in prison — hopefully until long after his daughters are adults and free of his dictates and criticisms)
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Allison was a classic victim of the ‘idealise, devalue, discard’ treatment of a narcissist/sociopath. In typical parasitic form, he targeted her to add class and substance to his fraudulent life. She came from a good family, she spoke two languages, she had a great career and good prospects and offered him prestige. But then because he can’t live up to her, he sets about tearing her down, making her feel inferior to her. The one thing she prided herself on – being a good mother – was the very thing he targeted. He and his rotten family are not fit to walk in the same street as Allison or her family. She was the trusting victim of a con man and she deserved a good man – not this emotionless, murdering fraud.
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If you use the Hare Psychopathy checklist is describes GBC perfectly. Allison was a beautiful woman and her eyes project kindness. She is type of woman every guy dreams about. But this patriarchical misogynist, destroyed her literally and chose trailer trash? Maybe because he could at least feel superior to TMcH, whereas to Allison he had no hope. She was way above him and this must of hurt his manhood. He needed an ego boost, to feel remotely adequate. bbcpaus, I salute you.
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Thank you.
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GBC’s ‘belting’ the girls could have resulted in another court appearance for assaulting his girls and possibly losing them.
I hope he never sees them again they are in the position they are by his doings, no one else’s.
He wrote, produced, directed and starred in this one man show. Let’s hope the ending was not what he had cunningly planned.
If found not guilty he will be unemployable, who’d do business with him…even with an insurance pay out to build his real estate empire with no clients, who’d trust him.
I have an Aunt and Uncle living on Sydney Harbour (not Brookfield) my cousin was always called GerrARD sounds French unlike Gerrid or Gerry.
I can’t get over the BCS offering the Dickies a mug of tea in their driveway..now, that is classless.
Bring it on Mr Fuller…
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Test message ……….. G’Day Robbo and all.
So much work has been done on the site, it looks great!
Not sure if I still have my strange little avatar or name. Cannot quite remember my pseudonymn
New computer, new house, new server and new email, but here goes !!!!
I hope Justice is served and all will be revealed and not concealed.
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Hi doll email me at aussiecriminals@gmail.com and we can track down the old you…cheers
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Robbo, thank you for putting this site together, especially the commentary of what witnesses had to say in court. I’ve read something similar on a news site, but you’ve included a bit extra here. I remember when this lady first disappeared, but I have only started to follow this case closely since the trial began last week.
I’ve read a lot of articles from news sites and from this site, and there are some obvious mistakes in some articles about dates and events etc (that’s in the news sites) but there is also some information that has let me wondering what has happened to that particular piece of information or that has left me unclear about what is true/fact or not. So I was hoping others that are on this site might be able to shed some light on a few things.
Firstly I read on one news site (I cannot remember which one because I’ve read so many) that there was a reported sighting of a large, white 4WD trailing a smaller blue 4WD near the bridge where ABC’s body was discovered. And these two cars where seen in the early hours of the morning that ABC was reported missing, I think it said at about 4:00am they were spotted. And they were moving slowly and that the white 4WD only had it’s park lights on. But I have not heard anything else about this since.
Next I am confused about what the blood sample in GBC’s Prado showed. I’ve read that the Prosecution claims that it revealed through DNA testing that it belonged to ABC. But I’ve also read that the Defence claims it only showed up in a luminol test which proves that it is blood but does not prove who it belonged to (and can also be unreliable if other contaminants are present such as urine). So does any one know which test it was?
I am also confused about what has been said in regards to GBC crashing his friends car at a shopping centre. I have read that one theory is that this was done deliberately to mask existing injuries. But I thought police had already photographed/documented the abrasions on his face, neck and chest regions the day that he reported ABC missing. If he had any other injuries wouldn’t the police have discovered this at the time. Surely they sent him for an examination? Is it suggested that he had more injuries that the police had not noticed and it was these that he was attempting to conceal or explain by having a car accident a few days later?
Also does anyone know whether police were able to verify how the damage to the Prado’s front bumper bar occurred? GBC told police on the day he reported ABC missing that he had had a crash earlier in the week.
Lastly does any one know if the information the police put forwards about GBC’s phone being taken off or on the charger in the early hours of the morning of the 19th April (I think they said about 1:30am, but not sure about the exact time), is accurate? I know that the claim he was on face time over night was wrong, but I was wondering if the on/off times of charger were accurate?
From the information I have read I don’t see how the Prosecution can tie GBC to ABC’s death. Especially if the blood sample (if there is one) from the Prado is not a DNA match to ABC (and even if it is this is circumstantial evidence). No one saw him leave that house that night/morning and no one saw him returning to it. His three daughters heard nothing and saw nothing and reading their statements to the police they sound like they were being honest and uncoached.
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http://astrologyincrime.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/1st-bail-application-documents.pdf this should help you dissecting the news from the established case from the police.
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thank you palmtree, that makes for very chilling reading. But it is still a mystery about how ABC’s body came to be where it was found as the autopsy report said it must of been placed in that position shortly after death. It would of been very difficult to place her body there in the dark and without being seen at any point. Even the first police officer who tried to get down there injured himself and had to abort the mission.
If GBC did do this then why was no blood found at the house or in the carport/yard? That luminol test would show up even the slightest trace. And he would have been busy all night and yet no one saw anything?
As for the children and the debriefing claims, I can understand that to a certain extent as everyone who got the chance would be trying to get them to comment on what was going on. I still do not believe that they would protect their father if they thought he had done anything wrong involving their mum. And God help him if they do know something as they will reveal it as they get older. Also since they are in the care of their maternal grandparents, I think they would of revealed something to them if there was anything to reveal.
On another note though I have read the evidence given by TMH in court and she sounds like a very scary individual. I’m not saying she had anything to do with this but she appears to be a very controlling, manipulative and angry person who obviously wanted to become GBC’s next wife. I think that from when she first met GBC she was determined to go after him. I bet her decision to change careers had less to do with wanting a change in job and more to do with cracking onto GBC.
I know this is certainly no laughing matter but Priscilla Dickie’s testimony yesterday did make me smile a little, in the way she expressed her disbelief at GBC having the audacity to be wearing a business shirt with pink and white stripes on it and how outright “strange” it was when GBC brought out the cup and saucers for a cup of tea instead of the usual mugs. No wonder why someone commented on here about the overflow Court 17 erupting into applause when this lady gave her evidence. She wasn’t going to leave anyone in any doubt about what she thought.
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Hi Sam
My father was in the police for 22 years and after sending him the same report i posted to you, he said to me ‘the jury would have a hard time finding him not guilty, so long as all the evidence is admissible in court’. We already know the defence will do what they can to make some of those statements inadmissible. You are right, there are questions that are unanswered and given the circumstances may go on unanswered which is an absolute tragedy. All we can do is wait to see what the rest of the trial brings – no doubt prosecution is working their arguments in reverse (from weakest argument to strongest) so the jury has the most compelling issues fresh in their mind at the end.
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I agree with your father.
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Me too… But as one whose father was a CIB detective for 17 years I have little faith in the bleeding hearts and downright dumbos who end up on the jury and get conned and stupefied by complicated homicides and slick defence barristers. It’s never a done deal with a jury and I pray for the Dickie family that the jury have enough common sense to find him guilty on the immense circumstantial evidence. If he gets off I think I’ll give up on this society for good !
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PS: Thank God he has stepped into that witness box. He is an aggrandising, artificial liar and they do not do well on the stand 🙂
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I disagree. There r other ways to prove, not the direct evidence of killing someone, but the more indirect facts, in a lot of crime cases.
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Hi All, long time reader, first time poster. I have been following this case since its inception as i grew up in the area and was close by that night. On that Thursday night i was at my partners place in the neighboring suburb of Pullenvale fixing her horse float lights and breaks for use on the coming weekend and was there untill at least 11.30 pm, when i left and drove back towards Kenmore on my way home. Although i never saw anything out of place that night, to think GBC and Co were executing their plan and that i may have driven past them is cirtinly chilling. There has never been a doubt in my mind that GBC is guilty as sin, and his father is an accessory to the crime. One point that has really stuck out to me is GBC’s robotic penchant to blurt out in the very first instance at any of his initial police interviews “she has been suffering from depression for the past 7 years and was on medication” closely followed by “can i speak to you in private” moving away from any family members that may have been present, and then blurting to the police “i have been involved in an affair”. This to me is his attemp in trying to sow a very early seed to give the impression that ABC was in a depressive state, that coupled with the devestating news on that fateful night that GBC delivered – he was leaving her, pushed her over the edge and she has left in the early hours of the morning, finially taking her own life. You can see this is the very line that the defence is taking.
What really happened? He carried this out for the 2 obvious reasons we all know – to end his relationhip with ABC and finially join his dispicable mistress TC who’s irate state drove GBC to finially deliver on his promise, and, to claim the life insurance, taking care of his financial difficulties. The finer details of how he carried it out we may never know, however i believe it was a predetermined act, escalating into a situation larger than he initially anticipated, he has gone to knock her off, underestimating how much she would fight for her very life, things didnt go to plan which caused him to panic. Many points of evidence add up to showing holes in the GBC testimony. I just hope to heaven for Alison’s sake that at the end of the trail we hear – Guilty.
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Hi Palmtree,
I’m sure with 22 years experience your father is very knowledgable. But on the evidence so far I’d have to disagree with him about the jury having a hard time finding him not guilty. Especially after today when the blood stain evidence was presented in court. The fact that it is relatively small and there is no way of knowing how old that stain was (I read somewhere that the family had the Captiva for a number of years), makes this evidence weightless.
If ABC did scratch GBC’s face it might of been during an argument, he admits they were discussing his affair during the evening. As for GBC’s phone being placed on the charger at 1:48am on 20th April, that could of been Allison if she was up at that time.
Even if GBC is being untruthful about the marks on his face and the exact events of the evening of 19th April/early morning of 20th April, this will not be enough for the Prosecution to get a conviction. They have no evidence to link GBC to ABC’s death.
If the jury do return a guilty verdict, I think it would be overturned by an Appeals Court.
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Sam, did you not notice in the police report that the family had been in possession of the Captiva for 8 weeks.
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I disagree. I think DNA matched blood and hair in the boot of a BC car makes a pretty strong case when added to the circumstances of the marriage, the negative results for the blood tests done on the razor which GBC himself volunteered, and those massive claw marks down his face. I live in a far more densely populated area than the BC’s did and I could come and go from my property late and through the night and there’s a high probability I would not see a neighbour. I also believe that the screams belonged to Allison and not the ring in defence witness who had the fighting teenagers. That’s just been an unlucky coincidence and I can’t fathom why Apps would have testified for BC.
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I wonder if the scientific dept can test that piece of hair to see if it had been to the hairdresser the day before, you would think Allison hadn’t washed it yet and that the chemicals and things to colour it would be still strongly evident the next day. Especially the exact colour matches which are recoreded in the hairdressers files.
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Hi Robbo, just wanted to say thank you for such a great site. It’s fantastic to hear the daily recaps from those who can attend court. Just wondering though, is there a problem with some of the ‘days’ of court as some of those links don’t work anymore (?).
Thanks again, brilliant site and thanks for all your work.
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Brigitte, that is a very interesting take on things. I’m not suggesting that Toni had anything to do with Allison’s demise but from reading what has been available in regards to conversations she had with GBC in emails etc, she struck me as a very demanding, domineering character who uses verbal abuse/bullying to get her own way. Joycelyn Frost one of GBC’s business partners said Toni could get very angry and wouldn’t speak to her for days if she said something that upset her. She seemed to have an attitude of entitlement over GBC regardless of the fact that he was married with three young children. Toni being a mum herself should of realised it is very difficult to walk away from the commitments that GBC had especially his attachment to his three girls.
GBC also must of had feelings or an attachment to ABC because he chose her over Toni when given the ultimatum and he did try to comply with Allison’s conditions even in the end he still seemed unhappy and got back in contact with Toni. GBC has been called a lot of things on these sites such as narcissistic and sociopath and he may well have a dark side (as do a lot of people) but I also see someone who has a strong desire to please the people around him that he is close to.
Take for instance one of his business partners’ comments about how when the business was struggling GBC wanted to continue paying “his team” good salaries. How one of the office staff described him as a “good boss” who was always “pleasant”. And how he is said to have given up work to help Allison when their first child was born. How he wouldn’t bag Allison out to other people. How he went along to counselling sessions when Allison requested that he do so. And how he gave Toni a “commitment” when she flared up at him about complying with Allison’s ultimatum. To me he seems like a people pleaser (although some of that good will may of been misguided such as paying staff he couldn’t afford to keep, and trying to commit to Toni after already committing to Allison).
He may well be delusional and unrealistic by thinking he could keep all these balls in the air but that does not make him a monster (unless of course he did murder Allison). He seemed to have been under enormous pressure from many areas of his life, who knows what people are capable of when under pressure, they say everyone has a breaking point.
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I actually believe everyone is overestimating how much motivation TMcH caused GBC. PRIORITY NUMBER 1,2 &3 was, at all times, money money money $$$$. Insurance money. TMcH was just another part of the complication but let’s not forget how obsessed GBC would have been about his debts. That insurance money was the key to solving all his problems !
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Same u seem very emphatic towards GBC now after his wife was murdered? Don’t forget (u seem to be forgetful) that in trial, GBC had mentioned he falls in love with TMH because she was a great sales woman, that’s enough to spell out his attraction towards TMH all the while, that’s satisfied to prove that his obsession with her unbroken even after the 1st break-up. What’s most important for a RE boss to have and to know of a prized sales person? That eventually leads to this gruesome murder of his own wife, just so, with his beloved lover. As a woman, we know. When u love a person, u can’t wait to spend your life with them, when u don’t love any more, u can’t wait to dump them like a hot potato!
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Robbo, sorry to bother you with trivialities, but my comment (10:01am 19th June) should of followed Brigitte’s comment (12:33am 19th June) but once I pressed Post Comment it slotted in above Brigitte’s comment.
One thing that I forgot to bring up and I would be interested to hear what others think, is that listening to Toni giving evidence in court, I was wondering if she still had designs on GBC and was holding out to see how things pan out? I wonder if she will pursue him if the verdict is favourable for him?
She made, what I thought was an interesting and unusual comment at the end of her last appearance in court. She said something to the effect of “..his girls (daughters) would never of accepted me anyway”. I’d like to know what other people made of that remark. How could she have known that without ever meeting them? Or was she just being on the defensive because she knew that while she could compete with Allison for GBC’s affections and possibly come out trumps it would be a very different story where his children were concerned. During their affair was Toni already worrying about how she would cope if she had to play second fiddle to GBC’s children?
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Quote Brigitte: The fact that Gerard’s family are standing by him to the extent they have been implies they consider someone else to be extremely culpable in the premeditation and coercing Gerard to be drawn into the commital of the murder of Allison
Means nothing of the sort. To me, it means they are standing by him. Full stop
Quote Brigitte: They are overall relatively decent folk who while disaproving of the murder, may well know first hand their son’s suseptabilities, escapist ways of dealing with stresses etc., and how he could be mis- led, cajoled, threatened and manipulated to get there
Decent folk who badmouth a murdered woman? Who feel it’s relevant to the case to tell the court and the world that while pregnant, Allison once vomited and suffered incontinence? Who claim she was ‘depressed’ because she wore neutral or dark clothing — as to millions worldwide — when in fact, Allison’s favourite colour was in fact yellow?
Who cares if they know of their son’s ‘escapist’ tactics .. which in fact means their son refused to accept reality, which seems to have been a family-trait? Then you say he *could be misled, cajoled, etc. We’re talking about a 40-something here, not a ten year old
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Re: his being supposedly ‘easily led’
Didn’t his girlfriend (one of them at least) tell the court how she admired his ‘drive’ ?
Doesn’t he tout himself as a ‘leader’ and ‘motivator’ ?
Can’t have it both ways
Pre-arrest he’s a ‘leader and motivator’
Post-arrest and you’re trying to sell him as ‘easily led’
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Gosh, I don’t know how I came to be here with this discussion as I have been reading daily but not seen this thread. It was very interesting to say the least.
I noticed one comment about the loose mistress being able to compete with Allison for the mad-rooter’s attention but not the children! Oh my Lord! Trailer Trash versus 5 star, I don’t think so. All his ‘bits on the side’ wouldn’t hold a candle to Allison (is that the saying I am looking for?).
I wonder how Jerred’s weekend on the inside is going? I know the weather on the outside is absolutely divine.
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Cameron Early, who supports the caterpillar attack story – real estate valuer and agent.
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I had a great time analysing the phone records and came up with a conversation between Toni McHugh and her lover – based on the actual calls made… bit of light reading for a quiet Friday in court. http://wp.me/p2Cfe3-YZ
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Wow, MM — just WOW !
The weird thing is, try as I might, I just cannot see GBC as any kind of stud and never have. To me, he’s similar to an onion (a rotten one) – layer after layer of shite, a neurotic cast of thousands crammed into that body of his, forever playing roles while humming, ‘ I just wannabe me and free of the Lega-ceeeee’
You have TM down pat, imo. Playing the role of Mrs Baden Clay from Allison’s chair at Century 21, riven by jealousy and Mills and Boon fantasies
Both of them – arrested development, imo
Thanks for a very interesting read 🙂
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One thing is for sure. GBC is lying. The scratches on his face are not shaving cuts. He has been lucky the witnesses have not been able to conclusively say they are from fingernails, but they have obviously made that assessment. If they were caused in a fight with ABC, why not admit to it? Why not say yes we had a bad fight and she stormed off walking into the night? He stuffed himself right there by claiming they were shaving cuts. They are clearly not.
GBC’s denials follow a familiar pattern of domestic murders committed in the heat of the moment. Normally these people are found guilty. In this case however, we don’t know or have any reasonable explanation for ABC’s cause of death or the location she was found. I suspect there is only one person, possibly two, who know how she got there.
Terrible for her poor children and family. Judging by the evidence given by ABC’s parents, they appear to be satisfied of GBC’s guilt. Given all the other troubles in their lives, it seems too strange a coincidence there was some other third party involved. It’s all related.
I’m not really sure the prosecution has a very strong case. Surely they need to give some explanation for how he supposedly killed her and transported her there.
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I think he has lured her into the back of the car and murdered her there. Armed with his new display of bowing to Allisons needs (all deceitfully false and self-serving to his plan)- of which we have heard evidence about how thrilled Allison was about this — ie – agreed to seeing the counsellor, having the discussions with her as suggested by the counsellor. Didn’t we read somewhere that he used to go “parking”, put the seats down and have his way with TMcH. We know he was downstairs – daughter said she got up for a drink of water and he came up stairs from the car or fridge. Was he preparing the scene? Hand over her mouth – chipped her tooth, teeth cut her lip, bloodied his hand and he has inadvertently knocked his hand against the side of the car panel – blood dripped down but it was dark and he did not see it to clean up before he placed the boxes of toys in there. Also is it possible that Allison wet herself (not uncommon when fighting for life) and he has cleaned it up – thus explaining the stains shown up with Luminol in an almost new car.
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Dora u r brilliant! I never thought like u thought so details. I think it’s most true that GBC might have killed ABC in the car instead and that explained why their 3 daughters never heard of scream,but instead other neighbours lived around heard ABC’s screams because they were downstairs so voices were easily spread around to outer areas. Please post more of your analysis.
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I’m sure he’s guilty.
The bridge she was found under is quite a distance from their house. The only real way to walk to it from their house is down a busy state road that has many hills, is dimly lit and in most places the road goes right up to the edges of rocks and trees. It’s really quite implausible to walk it and if someone tried to cars would see them (it’s not so dimly lit they wouldn’t at least see them) and find it so unusual that they would absolutely remember seeing someone walking that road and report it when she went missing. Both because of the story being all over the news the next day and because the police stopped cars on that same week night not long after asking anyone if they saw anything that night. This localised knowledge of how implausible that walk would be could be why they didn’t want anyone local on the jury, so it is good they did the excursion today because hopefully they have now seen what it’s like and thought about this for themselves. So how did she get there?
While decomposition of the body doesn’t allow them to determine cause of death they said they can rule out a jump/fall from the bridge because of no broken bones. So how did she end up deceased under that bridge? If it was suicide with drugs you could do that in your own home, you don’t need to go to all that trouble to get to that bridge for that. The toxicology test while hard to be specific in the results so long after death didn’t suggest drug overdose and it is hard to overdose from that Zoloft apparently.
Several neighbours heard a woman’s scream around the timing of that night and other noises. At least one mentioned it sounding like it got ‘cut off’ and it sounded ‘blood curdling’. I’m not convinced it was that other person’s daughter who ran into a spider web but I don’t know too much on these reports to say how confident I’d be if on the jury.
Not only did several doctors who treated Allison say they thought she was in no way suicidal but the interview tape of GBC himself that morning said he didn’t think she was. Friends said she was also doing better than in the past.
He claims to not have seen her since he went to bed that night but his description of what she was wearing on a morning where he never saw her was exactly accurate when she was found.
GBC told the mistress he couldn’t afford a divorce but he’d be out of the marriage by July 1. Sure, he had made her promises before but this is the first time he gave a firm date and sounded as confident. If he couldn’t afford a divorce but was going to get out of the marriage what does that leave?
GBC searched for terms like ‘self incrimination’ and ‘taking the fifth’ in the days shortly before she went missing. Now sure he claims he was watching a TV show and that got his interest but he also googled self incrimination apparently just before he phoned police that morning. No mention of watching a show that morning! Actually I’m not sure if they have gotten to this in the trial yet.
Blood in the new car that I think they said was hers and if the blood wasn’t hers then the hair in it was definitely. I would like more information on where it was found in the car specifically because the small detail I heard on where it was found in the car it didn’t sound like somewhere she’d naturally have been. Interesting too the father was seen taking a vaccum cleaner out of the car the next morning while GBC was talking to police. Concerned it contained evidence from cleaning the car post murder? I don’t buy the story about having to go vacuum a house for a person’s open house the next day. It doesn’t sound like something important enough to ask his father to do right away or that it’d be important enough to cross his mind while he’s stressed out talking to police about a missing wife or that his father would agree to as being that important to do. Did he give him that person’s house keys?
She had gotten her hair freshly done that afternoon. When they find her she has traces of 6 plants in her hair, all 6 found at her house but only 2 found in the bridge/creek area. How did she get the other 4? Would she have exercised with freshly done hair before the conference?
She made plans for the next day, future plans made so soon before suggest the expectation to follow through.
Completely broke, debts due, no money, and the debt about equal to what her life insurance would give him
Some other things I’ve heard that I’m waiting to see if are true and form part of the trial
Honestly, here you have a woman, a mother, who has no ties to crime. She has had ups and downs with depression over many years but never been considered suicidal een though times have been worse. She is found in a very unsuual location and her husband is acting very suspicious. Cops that arrive first on the scene are concerned by what they see of him, and they turn out to be right.
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Re: blood in car, this was detailed in evidence at the trial- it was described as as “dripping down” the boot door. They didn’t say whose blood it was.
Moving the vacuum cleaner is extremely suspicious. But I assume police would have examined it and they didn’t get anything from it. Maybe GBC got lucky on that one too. It also makes me suspicious of NBC’s knowledge. I’m not sure why but the earlier Facetime call we heard about it hasn’t been mentioned during the trial and NBC wasn’t asked about it, other than to state when he was first contacted by his son, which was around 7am or something.
I like your thinking about her freshly done hair and then the plant material found from her backyard. It’s very strange, and I think that evidence will be presented today. But also, it’s possible that after GBC went to bed, an intruder broke in, dragged ABC to the backyard, where she screamed and was then rendered unconscious etc.
But then, nothing explains the fingernail scratches on his face. ABC wasn’t going to let him get away with it.
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Great post, Susan — one of the best 🙂
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I like it Susan. Post more often, please. Thank you.
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Yes ! Exactly my thoughts about the clothing. He has stated she was in pyjamas and thick socks watching tv and yet describes the track pants and hoodie etc. He also says that her side of the doona was turned back when he woke up. He then contradicts himself and says she didn’t come to bed. Then we are meant to believe that ABC keeps his phone all night … And supposedly stays up util 1.30am when she needs to be ready to leave by 7.00am. B******t ! It’s hard to tell the perfect lie when it’s all so complicated, isn’t it !?
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Hi Mr Thusle, the Facetime call that the police forensic technology people put forward proved to be a false positive. Apparently GBC’s phone did not have the ability to facilitate facetime and the police admitted that their programs for detection produced an incorrect result and that no such call took place.
The final evidence that was presented today in regards to the six plant species found on Allison has confused me further. At first I thought that because all six were present at the BC’s residence and only two at the Kholo Creek site, that this was strong evidence that something terrible had occurred at the house.
But then when the witness pointed out where these plants were, in and around the property, it just did not make sense. With the Crepe Myrtle being at the back of the property and the Lilly Pilly at the front gate, and others along the driveway, it just seems illogical. To fit in with this evidence Allison would have had to have been dragged all around the yard and that is a big yard. The Crepe Myrtle and the Lilly Pilly must of been 60 odd metres apart at least (from the back of the yard to the front gate near the driveway)?
I live in a similar area to Brookfield and all these plants are very commonly found on many properties.
Like you Mr Thusle, I also think many other scenarios are just as feasible as what the Prosecution is putting forwards. The evidence in this case does not explain what happened.
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What if she picked the plants up from being in the back of the 4WD while she was transported? They might have legitimately moved plant clippings in the car before that to one of the nearby bushy areas?
I’m not sure what I think happened that night but I am sometimes thinking along the lines of the girls went to bed, they decided to do their 15min chat somewhere in or around the house where to not disturb the girls or for them to hear their private conversation. The topic of the mistress being there the next day probably got raised. GBC was probably sick of hearing about it re some of the things counsellors testified he said. The whole thing went south. He might have put his hands on her throat and not let go. So she scratches and claws at him trying to get him to stop and let her go. He didn’t stop. It’d explain the scream getting cut off and the relative silence. Then he realised what he’s done and has to move the body. He decides he can’t leave it in or around the house or he’ll be caught. It’s heavy so he has to drag it. He can’t drive too far though or people might see him out and about. He decides Moggill Rd heading outbound will get him out of the suburb. It’s dimly lit, there are no traffic cameras, minimal opportunities to side by side with his car and it leads to equally bushy and remoter areas. He knows the area near Kholo from his scouts connections. So he takes her there, comes home and cleans the car and the rest is history.
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Susan — your post is manually ‘Liked’ 🙂
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Sam, the fact remains that of the six plant species found on the body, four were from the house. And as you must know, plant debris, seeds, pods, etc. do not remain immediately upon or beneath the tree or bush in question. They are blown around by wind, by breeze and are carried by water when it rains. So it’s not at all surprising plant debris would be all over the place. And as most are aware when they tidy the yard or sweep up fallen leaves, twigs, seeds etc., — they gather in corners and nooks and crannies, such as a carport for example
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Yes, windows of car left open would allow for Brookvale-specific spores to be in the cars perhaps. That then leads me to consider if perhaps the 15min conversation was held in the car (windows up), so as not to disturb the girls.
Gerbil is scratched on the RH cheek and so if Allison is right handed he would need had to have been behind her or maybe face turned away (so as not to witness what he was doing and could therefore deny that he did smother/strangle her).
We also mustn’t lose sight of the fact that the hyoid bone wasn’t broken, which is usually the case for a manual strangulation.
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Hi MountainMisst :-). Read your brilliant post from further above last night. Haven’t accessed The Key as yet but will
Yep. That vital hyoid bone. Resilient body part, who knew until now, huh. But NOT drowning, that’s been conclusively put to bed. Guess they would have tested soil from around and beneath the remains – if so, stabbing or other vital wound not in the picture. No skull fractures? No bullet wounds. Process of elimination seems to point to smothering/suffocation. Not conclusively established. Can’t be. Jury will draw its own conclusions …
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Oh, I didn’t hear that then suffocation maybe? Or I guess a wack on thread as there was that blood…
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Maybe not explain precisely but when 2 people could tell us what really went down, 1 of whom has been silenced.
There has been an almighty tussle in that there yard.
Domestics in my house, as in heated verbal discussions, are mobile. I like space but I also like to be out of hearing distance from the children if it is out of the norm, say for example if I lose some inhibitions and get a little animated.
That shin injury of Allison’s you wonder if she left any bark somewhere?
I recall it was miserable weather that Thursday night and somewhat muggy Friday morning as I was pleased to be flying west to the dry atmosphere. Humidity and freshly styled hair do not go together. Sweat is another spoiler to a good ‘do’.
On a sad note, given that Allison is/was a beautiful woman, I hope she felt ‘pretty’ and energized prior to being hurt and taken from this earth.
Every time I see a yellow flower now I think of Allison. Butterflies get me in touch with another friend. Feathers for my father. The moon for a faithful pooch.
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Oh Little Fish — your heart 🙂
Humidity and freshly styled hair do not go together. Sweat is another spoiler to a good ‘do’. On a sad note, given that Allison is/was a beautiful woman, I hope she felt ‘pretty’ and energized prior to being hurt and taken from this earth
What a wonderful thing to say, Little Fish
Little black butterfly for me — our little dog found us after we’d moved 900 kilometres away, ten years after he’d had to leave us. You just know. Doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks. You know. And it’s wonderful 🙂
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I hope she did too, she didn’t deserve anything like this to happen to her, neither did her family or children.
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Hi Sam
Thanks for the info about the facetime call. The evidence re: plant species is highly significant becuase it clearly shows ABC was dragged by her feet around the patio/carport/driveway area. That is where the cats claw and myrtle creeper are located on their property – all near or around the car port.
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I think he was carrying Allison and had to put her down at some point to open the boot or a door, that’s why there were dead leaves in her hair too. Or perhaps he just needed to catch his breath as he had just expended a huge amount of energy. He may have even put Allison down several times, first he would have gotten her out of the house, in case the girls woke up, stashed her somewhere dark in the garden. Then got his disposal plan together and when he was ready to leave and the coast was clear, he would have picked her up again and put her in the car. They all came from the ground where they had blown. There were fresh ones too like they had just been ripped off. This makes me think he was carrying her across the front of his body and her hair touched the plant in a narrow walkway. He was in a very big hurry to get back to the girls sleeping alone in the house and overlooked this very important slip up. There were perhaps more that he removed and these were just the ones he missed.
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Perhaps he cut Allison’s wrists in the car before he took her to the resting spot and that’s why the dripping blood was in the car. There must have been some kind of protective covering on the boot as there is no blood on the base of the boot. He would have maybe imagined she would be found sooner so he would have wanted her death to look like suicide, unlikely he would have caused her body to have injuries that were sustained by a killer.
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Very vivid explanation in sequence, that the Prosecution/Police should have come to as well.
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Evidence from the forensic scientist today re: DNA has been enlightening and somewhat damning for GBC in my view.
The blood in the boot of ABC’s car was Allison’s. It would therefore seem extremely likely GBC has transported her body in the boot of her car to Kholo Creek bridge. Her only injury detected was a chipped tooth, however we know she may have had other facial injuries that caused the blood. He has then folded down the seats and put the toys in there as an attempted distraction – because the police had to fold the seats back up to see the stain.
No smoking gun with GBC’s DNA not found on ABC’s fingernails. But possibly more to come this afternoon.
The botanist reference to the Scout Hut has really firmed my view that GBC knew the Scout hall, knew the track to the creek and that is how he placed her body there. I don’t understand why he just placed her there to be found though.
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No body — no insurance pay-out
To be suspected is that he/they were counting on-hoping that the creek would wash her downstream and be discovered and that it would be believed suicide or random attacker
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Quite possibly hey. I also have wondered if he didn’t place her under the bridge but she got washed down the creek in all the wet from the scout camp. How lucky for him decomposition hid so much. I think the fact they found what looks to have been a second person’s DNA under her nails, after all that water and decomposition and the fact profiling her own DNA off them wasn’t easy, that it shows how much skin she clawed off her attacker. Funny, we’ve seen someone who seems to have been missing a fair bit of skin that looks like nail marks…. 😉 Justice for Allison I say.
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Because he felt safe there and he knew the area and it was special to him. He wanted Allison to be found, sooner than she was in fact.
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Hi folks, I haven’t forgotten about this page, just so much happening and other stories to share I cant get around as much as I would like.
It is good you can chat here knowing it is a continuous stream (If you have the time to read everything!)
I will have a good read tonight to get a better grip, thanks though for being part of the community
Robbo
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Hi Robbo. Your post makes me think of those people lucky enough to have such massive mansions, they forget to use some rooms for years, lol
Yes, people drop in here now and then. Never know what you’ll find 🙂
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well, GBC is going to give evidence. very surprising. i thought he would just cop it sweet. hopefully the Crown will ask the following questions:
-Why was your phone put on charge at 1.48am? Was it normal for your wife to put your phone on charge in the middle of the night, when she was planning to be up early? I thought you said you went to sleep at 10pm?
-Can you explain the cuts on your face, given expert witnesses have said they were not shaving cuts as you claim?
-Why would there be blood in the boot of Allison’s car?
-Why would there be plant matter from your backyard in Allison’s hair?
-Did you feel under much pressure at the time- with all the marital issues, financial problems, demands from your mistress, questions about the affair being raised?
-Have you ever been to the Scout Hall near the Kholo Creek bridge? Do you know the area?
-Would claiming Allison’s life insurance have relieved you from your financial problems?
-What do you think happened to Allison?
He thinks he has his story straight and taking the stand might be enough to put enough doubt in the jury’s mind. Hopefully the prosecution tear him to shreds.
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Ok so this post may serve me well, let’s see how the defence answers my proposed questions:
Q1. Why was your phone put on charge at 1.48am? Was it normal for your wife to put your phone on charge in the middle of the night, when she was planning to be up early? I thought you said you went to sleep at 10pm?
Answer:
Mrs Baden-Clay would check her husband’s mobile phone each night to monitor his calls, text messages and emails.”It was a kind of routine where he’d hand the phone to her … and not get it back until the morning.”
Conveniently, this cannot be corroborated although could very well be true, particularly noting GBC had a secret email address. However not sure why she would need to have it overnight and give it back in the morning.
This looks like a lie and sounds like a lie so my summation is…it’s a lie. Albeit a minor extension of the truth. she may well have had his password and checked his phone every day, but she was meant to be up early to be at a conference from 7am. Why was she putting the phone on charge at 1.48am.
Question for the prosecution:
How much sleep did Allison have each night? Did she need a good 7/8 hours like normal people, or could just go on say 4 hours sleep? How likely is it knowing she had conference she was very excited about the next day, that she would stay up until 2am, then go for a walk in the morning before 6am?
Q2. Did you feel under much pressure at the time- with all the marital issues, financial problems, demands from your mistress, questions about the affair being raised?
Answer: No, everything was sweet as.
Ok.
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Byrne: Gerard will tell you that…………blah blah.Well just let him.
You know why the silk is telling the story?
Because GBC will not say it like this, succinct and factual sounding like a lawyer.
They want some seeds planted in jury heads before dickhead gets up and stuffs it all up after rehearsing for 12 months
Another classic defense tactic
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The defense is trying to paint a rosy picture of domestic happiness and financial security. But that doesn’t explain why GBC was promising his mistress he would leave his wife by July 1.
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Seems the defence is trying to imply two alternatives for how Allison ended up as she did:
1) “The mistress did it”. Those comments his lawyer said about Toni just finding out Allison would there the next day and that Toni’s volatile suggest this is one way they’ll try to play it. I don’t buy this. First he broke up with Toni once to stay with Allison and breaking up with her for Allison would have made her much more angry then than Allison just being a conference with her. If she didn’t hurt Allison back then why would she be sufficiently motivated to now, now when Gerard has given her a date he’s leaving Allison by? She always believed his promises. Second, it sounded like Toni wanted to have a go at Gerard not Allison when she found out about this conference so there’s nothing to say she was targeting Allison. I’m sure the police would have investigated down this line anyway. Next how did Toni find Allison if she did it? If he’s going to claim that Allison put his phone on the charger about 1:30am to say he really was asleep (she had to be leaving by 7 why would she be up at 1:30 still?) then it can’t have been done that night so what then in his story, Toni knew Allison would go for a walk and where she walked and find her do the deed then rush back home to get ready for the conference herself (cause she was there wondering where Allison was)? Please!! I hope the Jury don’t buy this. How would Toni know when and where she walked when even Gerard had more than one theory for where she could have walked? BS!!
2) “She was depressed and got disorientated and did it herself”. All the doctors said she had never had any indication of self harm even when she’d been more depressed, which was before rather than now when they said she was doing better. She’d also been on that medication for ages with no disorientation type psychosis to mention so she seemed to react fine to it. In their theory what, she goes for a morning walk gets disorientated, noone sees her and she ends up walking many many kilometres for hours through either unwalkable bushland or down a busy road and noone sees her and she manages to find her way into the creek and then hurts herself fatally drowns? All before she regains her orientation Oh come on seriously. BS!!
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or possibly 3) she went for a walk that morning and was randomly attacked.
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I haven’t heard them say anything towards this yet myself but you’re right they’ll probably propose this idea too.
With her apparently sticking to the main roads on her walks and that time of the morning being light and with morning traffic beginning at Mt Crosby and Brookfield, that’d be pretty lucky to be able to both attack her without being seen and dispose of the body at the bridge without being seen. Especially in that kind of area it’d be a pretty unusual crime.
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Then take her back to her house & put her in her own car bleeding…
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I am so appalled (but not surprised) with GBC whole demeanor and attitudes. His whole arrogance counterance smacks of him (in his mind) being so much better than Allison in all areas. Multiple mentions of his job paying more or being more important. I also noticed the little digs at the Dickies — ie Allison did not want to talk to her parents,….. Allison was under great pressure to be perfect. Lastly, why am I not surprised with the multiple referrals to Lord and Lady Baden-Powell and the scouting movement?
The good thing is that by taking the stand I believe he is adding to the prosecutions case.
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One thing about the whole case that stands out with me is: Clinically depressed people are not likely to be going for an early morning walk most mornings. By their own testimony the BC’s have stated the evidence of Allison’s depression was in her laying on he couch with the curtains drawn or sleeping in bed during the day. At the same time they want it believed that she was so depressed on April 19/20 2012 that she took her own life. But in April 2012 she was taking early morning walks, getting her hair done, trying to lose weight so she looked good for an up-coming holiday, attending conferences …. along with many many other activities. To me that is depression well under control. They can not have it both ways.
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I agree and the doctors said she was doing much better and even at her worst was never considered suicidal. In the police interview recording the morning she went missing even GBC said shed been doing better and was happier. After having darker times why would she have then decided to end it now?
I want to know how GBC sounds and looks giving his testimony. Have you seen his news interview on YouTube from while she was still missing? I wonder if it’s like that.
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Dora, u r very right, I have depression/anxiety, I can never get up early to have a walk around the suburb I live because I normally feel safer to curl under my blanket than to leave home! i.e. Allison never been truly depressed and sexless. She had bounce of energy and so much positive in believing GBC had left his marital affairs, had changed to a ‘good’ husband and father etc etc.
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Has any mention been made of GBC,s car accident on Sunday 22nd April 12 Where he drove a friends Honda CRV into the onramp pylon at Indropilly shopping centre on Moggill Rd ? And set the airbags off in the car to hide his facial scratches ?
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Yes that was another brilliant move by him
my son saw it minutes after it happened not knowing it was him. Came home & said some fool has driven into the pylon & looks like it was done on purpose.
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Love it !
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Some fool. The one and only fool. 🙂
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What about the news footage at the time of police flagging cars at Kenmore Roundabout asking drivers if they saw his Prado on the roundabout with a chain dragging? NGC seen standing weirdly waiting at a bus stop in Kenmore early hours of her disappearance. CCTV footage at Kenmore Village Shopping centre showed roundabout. Not mentioned in court so far I don’t think but my friend had to ring a 1300 number as she used the roundabout at the time but did not see his prado.
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This is a post everyone following this case should read. This is my first and probably only post that does not contain any astrology. 🙂
I’ve followed up on the Flight Centre history providing the court documents exposing Gerard Baden Clay’s ridiculous claim against Flight Centre for Breach of Contract plus also the Notice to Defend by Flight Centre.
http://astrologyincrime.com/2014/06/27/no-flight-of-fancy/
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Thanks MM. Very interesting. This man is all ego. I believe he actually believes his own lies.
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They often refer to this saying in real estate …. “Perception is reality”. GBC believes if he says something often enough it will become an accepted version. Mark Twain said, “a lie is half way around the world while the truth is getting its shoes on”. Perhaps GBC is pinning his hopes on that.
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Dora, the weird thing about it is a lot of others believed his lies too.
The endless supply of suckers, women, borrowings and scams.
What happened to all the money?
Any woman who lived the life of Allison would certainly suffer anxiety. Only a block of concrete wouldn’t be affected.
Imagine being at the school canteen to be told of your husband’s affair. Oh cringe with horror!! Poor woman.
Of course she’d have flashbacks. 😦
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Thanks for posting that, enjoyed that read.
I did hear a rumour in the past about why he was suddenly terminated from Flight Centre. Not the specific details but the general gist. Not sure I can say the rumour here. In any case if the rumour is true it’s pretty amazing he has the gall to sue them rather than just being relieved he wasn’t worse off.
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By the end of next week we will all know…
Allison’s chart is plumping for Thursday. If it is indeed Thursday that will be unfortunate for her eldest daughter Hannah, as that’s her 13th birthday. But then I’m pretty lousy at predicting things…
Allison’s birthday is on Tuesday 1st July.
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Somewhere… not far away because there wasn’t much time, is whatever he wrapped Allison in and the footwear he was wearing when he went into the mud because he wouldn’t have wanted cuts on his feet too. Maybe a sleeping bag, that boot is very clean apart from the blood and Allison would have lost more hair than one especially after having it dyed and bleached the day before. I rekon it was a sleeping bag. Being big campers they would have lots, I wonder if one is missing from their collection, only the girls would know that.
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Shower curtain…when the house was put up to rent months later there was no shower curtain. Just a guess
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I think the cops/kids/parents would have noticed that
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He’s got an excuse for everything else…
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I fail to see how there is any relevance to the last two days of GBC’s evidence. All this back story just went on an on but it’s not in any way relevant to what happened the night of ABC’s disappearance. All complete irrelevant. I hope the prosecution doesn’t waste as much time going through the minutiae of detail from 20 years ago. Get to the point and expose his thinly veiled bullshit. I think the defense is just trying to distract the jury and put some time between the prosecution witnesses evidence and their deliberations.
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look at this bloke’s excuses – his excuses for having affairs:
“He told of embarking on the affairs after his wife became depressed, lost her sex drive and put on weight” So essentially, Allison is to blame. What a disgusting blight on the poor women.
“He said he continued sleeping with his long-term mistress, Toni McHugh, for the “sake of the business’’, because he feared what she would do if they split. So again, he’s not at fault, he was only doing it to “save his business”. Again, he doesn’t take responsibility for his own actions.
GBC clearly, in my unprofessional view, has a Cluster B personality disorder. Take a look at this page and tell me that each and every one of these traits is not present when listening to GBC:
http://counsellingresource.com/lib/therapy/self-help/understanding/2/
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He sure has mate, it’s so obvious. I think the prosecution are doing a good job of just letting him reveal his MO one little bit at a time. This Flegg guy has him pegged. The jury will too. GBC has so many contradictions in his values and patterns of relating, depending on who he is targeting and what he is trying to cover up, that he can’t even see himself bringing himself undone on the stand. He’s not even that smart or smooth at all, it was always a veneer and now we are seeing the chipboard that he is really made of.
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Mr Thusle, May I remind you he is a Baden-Clay ! He is SOMEBODY ! And I bet mommy dearest aka the MATRIARCH has told him how special, and perfect he is his WHOLE LIFE ! It is NEVER his fault – he’s the golden boy – entitled and deserving of adoration. He is perfect don’t you know ? 😉
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I think Flegg has got him pegged and by asking him all these things he is pointing out how GBC is fine with lying. He hasn’t gone for the jugular yet and come out and said that, but he is building this rapport with him that is allowing GBC to explain his lies as justifiable and GBC is even admitting he lied to Toni and Allison quite matter of factly. Flegg is pointing out other lies GBC told, differing stories he gave people the morning Allison ‘disappeared’. Flegg is also looking at GBC’s behaviour in relation to how a normal person… who’s depressed, upset, anxious wife might have just disappeared…should have been reacting in that situation. He is hard pressing him for facts on motive for the jury to hear him now downplay the financial motive when he had been telling everyone, even the cops on the morning of Allison’s disappearance, they were on the bones of their arse. These whole two days are all about us getting used to how easy GBC finds lying, when it suits him. I imagine this will all come together towards the end.
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why did Allison need an STD check at her GP if as HE says the marriage was sexless?
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Good question, I imagine that A he lied about it being completely sexless and B it made her feel better.
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Where did you get that info from ? I missed that ! Was tat raised during the trial ?
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I can’t quite remember, I think it was in one of the marriage counsellors or other therapists questioning.
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I think the prosecution has done a great job, in highlighting the odd actions of GBC. I particularly liked the question about why GBC took the Captiva to look for Allison in the morning, when it was harder to get to than his own car. Yes GBC, why would you do that? a last minute check and tidy up of the car perhaps? With the vaccum cleaner you tried to get your father to remove perhaps? Unlucky for GBC, he missed Allison’s blood in the boot.
finally, the prosecution proposed what we are all thinking about each and every part of the evidence. That he probably smothered her and returned to put his phone on charge at 1.48am. Maybe if GBc had dumped her body in walking distance from their house (which wouldn’t have been that hard considering the Brookfield area is very ‘rural’) the defense argument about suicide/ overdose may have had some legs.
Now, over to the jury to see justice done.
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Allison wouldn’t get into the Prado because that’s where he & pussy galore had their little acts. If Gerb told Allison about pussy & him in her house why didn’t Allison have issues with that??
It is sickening how the BC’s relentlessly slandered Allison’s name on the stand. Is that what OW meant that the truth will come out? Nah the lies about the depression did not help Gerb and showed how this family works.
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As the great man repeatedly said, “when you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.”
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My thoughts – It was all about the money and the Toni conference incident that day brought everything to a head. I think the reason GBC is able to stay in such control is that in his mind he has justified his actions by making Allison a sacrificial lamb to save “face” “his name” and “his children”
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I wholeheartedly agree Elise. GBC pushed the wonderfully bright, successful and vibrant Allison down from the day he married her. He couldn’t divorce her due to the financial impact it would impose on him and the Baden-Clay clan and her certainly couldn’t risk the public humiliation of his infidelities being ripped open on the day of the conference. The witness statements say it all and the evidence expose his web of lies and deceit.
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I agree, I think the last 4 years of that marriage was a roller coaster .Even if she officially did not know about the affair his behaviour would have gradually changed . He would of become more cold and distant towards her. ABC loved her husband and her family and didn’t want to give up. By no means did ABC suffer from a clinical depression , she might be depressed but that would be a responsive depression to the constant lies GBC was telling her. By his behaviour we can sense his disrespect and almost rejection of Alison . Now if outsider can hear him between the lines so could she.
All he is trying to do is to avoid responsibility for the entire situation. It was not Alison who started the affair.
He found himself in a situation where he felt immense emotional and financial pressure.
While he constantly tells us how much he loved Alison he acted absolutely contrary to his comments.
Alison cannot tell us her side of the story because he silenced her.
The marriage was not loveless and sexless or anything.
The marriage was just like any long term relationship where everybody had their defined roles. He was on an ego trip when he had all that success and justified an affair on the side , why ,because he could. Forbidden sex is so much better than anything else, just watch TV.
Unfortunately most mistresses do not like to have sex without a commitment down the line so the pressure was building.
I really do not know why the father was put on the stand as the family is obviously bias and want to help their son no matter what.
I think from the time when ABC knew he had an affair the situation became explosive and resulted in ABC being murdered by him.
Now, he thinks if the jury will find him not guilty he is not guilty (as it was all her fault).
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I think it’s mainly due to Allison’s 2 life insurance policies, her superannuation and a shared property they both invested. It’s about ‘the wealth’ for him to stick to Allison, but it’s about a great real estate ‘asset’ – TMH, that he also can’t let go. Both women to GBC are excellent ‘assets’ to exploit for his advantages. He’ll at some stage kills his wife, but he made it on 19/4, caused of the conference that will explore him returning to TMH, i.e. he will lose all life insurance policies, Allison’s superannuation, their shared property investment to cover his large debts, so, he killed her, he had no choice, giving his helpless circumstances..
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OMG, I love Todd Fuller!! He is doing a stirling job. Bye, bye GBC, he’s gotcha. YES!!!!!
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Some of these comments are hilarious. You all clearly have no legal understanding whatsoever and can’t see that the prosecution hasn’t even gone close to establishing guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
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I have always thought from day 1 that GBC was guilty in fact am convinced of it. However, given the evidence, I am not sure, purely based on that evidence that I could put him in jail. So here I am separating what I know to be true (for me personally) from the evidence in front of me. What a tough job the jury have, I do not envy them and hope that they do what they think is right and can live with whatever decision they make. It is easy for us sitting on the outside of that court room to talk about what should happen, so much tougher for those faced with the situation and the facts, such as they are.
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When you or others think the case is weak, simply because this case is a circumstantial case, i.e. there is no direct witness that saw GBC killed his wife, but there were in fact hundreds of evidences together with what witnesses given, plus his mistress TMH own statements, are all more than enough evidences to prove GBC is guilty of murdering his wife, Allison. The Jury must be very attention in details and alert of every details here, i.e. the evidences left behind, not about GBC’s teary ‘confession’ etc.
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James – You wouldnt happen to be part of the Baden Clay fan club would you?
. I hope you also see how many people are praying for justice for Allison.
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No. But I am a lawyer and I can look at the case logically unlike most of the people commenting here and see that the prosecution’s case is inherently weak and flawed.
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Completely agree with you, James.
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But you also fail yourself as a lawyer in noticing many circumstantial evidences in this crime case, James, I think mentioning yourself as a lawyer doesn’t upholds your career in a way.
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You can barely get a coherent sentence out so I will go slowly for you. If someone can get convicted based on purely circumstantial evidence, and not much of it, it sets a dangerous and worrying precedent.
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What are stats on circumstantial trials for murder James? Sounds like you would know, cheers
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what a very condescending person you are!!!
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my above comment is for the very knowledgeable lawyer James, who I also find very hilarious 😂😂😂…Don’t you think it’s about time you change your profession?
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Lawyer James, you have many similarities with the murderer GBC. You are arrogant, disrespectful, you think you are above others, and most importantly, you are NOT as smart as you think you are. I wonder if you are really a lawyer too?
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WT ? Inherently flawed ? James, you must have cut yourself shaving this morning and driven your car into a wall, hence your confusion. Give our collective regards to G and Oscar Pistorius while you’re at it LOL !!!
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Great input. Don’t magnify your ignorance.
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You really need to look at this case for what it is.
The police cannot put GBC anywhere but the house in Brookfield the night Allison’s life was cut short.
Some trials have seen convictions based on circumstantial evidence but this one is lacking a lot of evidence. There was no DNA on Allison’s body to link GBC to the murder.
A lot of what we read and seen on the news was just a beat up by the media. His father was at a bus stop? No he wasn’t, if he was, it would have been mentioned during the Prosecutions case. His car spotted at a roundabout in Kenmore? No it wasn’t as this also would have been given a mention during the Prosecutions case.
At best, the Jury will return a verdict of- Guilty of Manslaughter. At the very worst, he walks.
If he had priors, it could be a very different ball game but he has no priors so getting a guilty verdict is going to be difficult.
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(Not speaking merely from hindsight, now that we have a verdict.)
Not so. The prosecution had a very good case, based on circumstantial evidence alone, certainly less than perfect, so what. As the judge said, in reply to the jury’s clarifying questions yesterday, they could convict, if the circumstantial evidence all pointed to one conclusion. And they had the option of manslaughter. AFAIC, the only serious weakness in the case was the lack of a crime scene. And the only minor weakness was the non-specific cause of death. We needed ten cold days instead of beautiful one day, awesome the next. In sum, the evidence passed the threshold required to get the case past committal, to trial.
There was a woman convicted in Qld, years ago, IIRC they called her the Black Widow, who shot her husband who was in the process of leaving her. The investigation started many months after the murder, because he was not reported missing until then. They didn’t have a body, and they had only a probable crime scene (blood splatter on wall) because she had replaced the carpet and repainted the bedroom. That case was based purely on circumstantial evidence, and there was much less circumstantial evidence (the total body of it) than in this one. QPS proved that she shot him while he was asleep, with a borrowed gun, and buried his body at sea, using a borrowed boat.
Granted, nothing is certain in a case that is based on circumstantial evidence. The GBC trial was more like the Lloyd Rayney trial in WA. That acquittal said more about the WA system of “justice” than about Rayney: the judge cried when he read the verdict and he pretty much spelled out where his biases lay. In Qld or NSW he would have been convicted.
Priors. Not so. There was a small mountain of evidence that GBC was a disgusting liar, and leading a double (triple ? sextuple?) life. He proved, by his own actions, that he was not of good character. It is a small step from that series of crimes and narcissism to murder.
Then there was the total lack of remorse. If someone else had killed Allison, he would have been, should have been, rope-able. He was not. If he had killed Allison in an uncharacteristic fit of passion, but he was normally of good character, there would be remorse. There was not. He thought only of himself.
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Quote: Then there was the total lack of remorse. If someone else had killed Allison, he would have been, should have been, rope-able. He was not. If he had killed Allison in an uncharacteristic fit of passion, but he was normally of good character, there would be remorse. There was not. He thought only of himself
Exactly. It’s what the public picked-up on, too. Look at Allison’s brother’s expression in almost every published photo of him. That should have been the expression on GBC’s face throughout
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Evidently not.
Evidently, the lay jury has more legal sense.
Evidently, most of the folks here have a much better grasp of the case than you. While not suggesting that they will all make good solicitors (we do not have lawyers in Straya), the pomp and ceremony that accompanies your statements indicate that you would be far more successful in another career, say , pole dancerg or movie extra. Give blog posts a wide berth.
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👍👍👍
for some reason everytime I click the like button, it takes me somewhere else so, had to do it this way
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I dont remember seeing anything about the topics Gerard was researching before Allisons demise. Has this been brought up in court? Hope someone can tell me.
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Does anyone remember the news footage of Police stopping cars and asking about GBC Prado being seen at Kenmore Roundabout with a Chain, CCTV footage? NBC standing at a bus stop the morning of her disappearance in the early hours? Has not been raised in court?
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Yes I wondered the same. I thought there was also another vehicle they were asking about also. Why has nothing about this been mentioned at trial?
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How do you find a person guilty of committing murder when there is no proof of GBC doing it? The way Toni was portrayed as the ‘raging bull’, infuriated by GBC’s actions or lack there of, she could have done it. We don’t know as we were not in the house at the time it happened. Toni could have scratched GBC’s face in rage of him not wanting to tell Allison they would be at the same Conference the next day. How do we know he was trying to get Toni off Allison?
We simply do not know. We know the plants found on Allison were from the Brookfield home. We know she didn’t overdose or drown but we don’t know how many were involved in her disappearance and who was involved.
The media were running stories daily after GBC was arrested. They reported his phone was plugged into his charger a few times during the night. We heard in court this was incorrect and it was only plugged in once at 1.48am. The media wrote about his father being at a bus stop, this was never mentioned during the trial.
Before I sign off. I did find it amusing that GBC did not know what a crime scene was. That had to have been a lie. Has he never watched the news and seen how police have closed off a house with tape as the house is a crime scene? He is either naïve or just plain stupid.
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another lie, then again after doing his daily duties for the school, cc, counseling staff, 5 calls daily to ma and pa, talk to the school principal about his affair, talking and emailing G.G, deleting his calls, doing the ironing, packing school lunches, making the bed he’d have zilch time to be watching TV
Another big lie is he said they had recommenced intimacy in february..if that were the case Allison would have certainly told the counselor.
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I do remember both of those things. There seemed to be lots of little things that we heard about early on that never came up in court.
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The reason we read and heard about these things happening is because the media created them, fabricated them if you like. There was a murder, they had nothing to write about as little was being leaked by the police.
I would be very surprised if the jury finds him guilty of murder. If anyone looks guilty of committing this, it’s Toni. She was promised the world by GBC and wanted to spend the rest of her life with him. He said he told Toni what Toni wanted to hear but according to him, it wasn’t the truth. That would enrage anyone would it not?
GBC made her look like the right villain when he took to the stand.
I’m not saying he did not partake in any of this but what I am saying is, he may be an accessory.
Only time will tell and at the moment, we have a jury who does not fully understand the difference between murder and manslaughter. They may end up dismissed and a new jury introduced.
The Prosecutions case is somewhat weak and is purely circumstantial. That doesn’t mean the jury can’t find him guilty, it just means their job is made harder as the Prosecution have no concrete evidence to suggest he murdered his own wife. The Defence on the other hand put up one hell of a case which could see him walk free.
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Yes, the media (ch 10) has headlines that the Jury had returned a verdict.
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On 20/04/12 there are no SMS messages to ABC on GBC’s phone records. In evidence are the 2 SMS that GBC supposedly sent Allison…one at 6.20 and the other at 6.41. Why are these Not on his phone records? (Page 15/50 GBC’s phone records).
Can someone please enlighten me????
You can see him texting ABC the night previous……so where are the SMS to Allison I’m the morning she went missing???
Sorry if this has been asked already..
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The SMS’ were mentioned by both Prosecution and Defence during the trial, Chantel. They were sent minutes apart.
Something is really annoying me with the Prosecutions case against him. When the trial began, the police interviewed the children and the eldest daughter said her dad was wearing a pair of joggers with his pj’s on. She asked, why are you wearing those shoes daddy? And he replied, I’m going too do some ironing. Yet he said he felt sick that night so he went to bed early.
Why in the Prosecutions closing was this not mentioned again, did they forget about it? And the razor he allegedly cut himself with. Why was that at his mother and fathers house? The police drove him to his parents house where it was and he came out of the house with it wrapped in cling wrap. They let him enter the house unaccompanied by an officer, that’s a big no no.
Hold on until Monday. The jury are expected to reach a verdict by then. I am expecting manslaughter at the very least. Not guilty sees him walk free and the children handed back to someone who may have killed their mother or, assisted in her murder.
I’m now heading off to work. Everyone have a great weekend.
BTW. I found this website when I was doing a google search of GBC and it would be fair to say, this is a great website. It seems to give everyone a chance of expressing themselves, putting their feelings out there. For obvious reasons, the media can’t take comments but this is great.
Keep up the great work.
Cheers,
Sean
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When this is over the transcripts can be be purchased..this is how authors get their books out so quickly. A dog eat dog profession.
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I absolutely love this website….I see a new perspective each and every time I visit. A funny thing looking at GBC’s phone records…he stops trying to call her by afternoon the next day. My husband became a missing person (we found him) and I didn’t stop trying to call him until we found him. Can someone please clarify the SMS post above or guide
me where I can read about it???
(edit by robbo i removed your last name, let me know if you want to use a nickname!)
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I have followed this website off and on for a few years and have enjoyed the sharing of information and lively discussion. I have been following the GBC case with great interest and am very appreciative of all the resources available here. Hope to see justice served for Allison tomorrow. There is no other choice! Thanks for the site and I look forward to tomorrow’s posts.
We will all be celebrating 🙂
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I don’t know who picked the Jury but they would have to be the most incompetent bunch of clowns I’ve seen grace the courts!!
They sat through the trial. The judge told them exactly how to deliver a verdict and on what grounds yet they continue to ask the judge more questions? Sack the lot of them and get some new blood in there ie; people who have a clue and basic understanding of the judicial system!!
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Eurhm.
It is a good thing that you did not pick the jury, innit.
That jury was so precise, that they had specific questions, and issues, which they presented to the judge, and which the judge answered, without reprimand. (There was a reprimand for downloading “how to a achieve a verdict”, but that is separate.) The questions were clarifying specific items of the judge’s summary and instructions to the jury, which the judge dutifully supplied, without complaint. It is possible that they have more understanding of our judicial system than some of the people who post comments on the web.
The result was a guilty verdict.
Which, based on your predictions (your post of July 14, 2014 at 8:22 am) was also beyond your expectations, your understanding of our legal system.
Chuckles
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👌
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You little ripper!! Guilty of Murder. GBC tells a security guard he can’t breathe. Stiff crap to him. Now he knows how his wife felt when he smothered her to her death. May he rot in jail and may the inmates give him hell!!
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Exactly, Sean. Having watched his victim die from lack of air, he knew how to ape it for the court. And got him nowhere, even though he was trying to steal attention from Mrs Dickie’s statement
I’m delighted, knowing where he is and how it must already be killing him. He can look forward to at least 15 more years of being powerless, being out of the loop
When he comes out, he’ll be sixty and still a pariah. His parents will be dead, his children grown, his friends long ago will have wiped/forgotten him. Just an ageing crim back out on the streets, all doors closed to him, all opportunities gone. Even the clown TM will surely have moved-on? If not, hope they live out their remaining years in total misery which is all they deserve imo
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I have been reading this website for a while, I did not participate until today because my position is, according to my understanding of Aussie Law, it is inappropriate to discuss a case which is before the courts, and particularly during the trial. The media is constrained by law, and I feel as Aussie’s, we should constrain ourselves as well, even if it is not explicitly illegal.
Although I have not been glued to the trial, I have followed coverage. Of course I am aware that the prosecuting case is based on circumstantial evidence, and what that evidence is. Therefore, I am upset to find out today, at the verdict (Yes!) and the summaries, that:
1 GBC had cuts on his chest and back (i.e other than his face)
2 He consulted with a criminal barrister on the day Allison went missing
Cheers
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GBC convicted, case closed. His arrogance and calm broke when he heard the verdict.
Toni McHugh convicted herself, nice and early, and got the hell out of the way. She had reserved her special place when she entered into adultery with a man who was married, with children; she confirmed her resrvation when she re-started it, and at the trial she made sure that her place was fully paid for. Case closed. All sins harm the soul, but fornication harms the body. I can wait ten years to see what she has really done to herself.
Allison and her family and survivors have life sentences. I won’t go on about that, but it must be said, they came across as a dignified family.
But there is more.
The trial scored a few more hits, as all trials do, because the goodness of justice being applied to a situation illuminates it, and illuminates much more than just the defendant and the charge. The murderer’s family came across as disgusting liars, interested only in closing ranks and protecting one of their own, not interested in Allison, or in the children, or in justice. The best they could do was to demean Allison, and rail about her depression, talk about how the (then) accused man “treated Allison like a princess”. Yeah, right, while he was two-timing her for years. Sure, he treated her like a princess when he “dumped her body in an undignified manner” (Byrne J). And Baden-Clay Sr was trying to get rid of the vacuum cleaner on 20 Apr, and the police had to stop him. Uh huh.
As Marissa Calligeros reported, a regular at the trial said:
“He’s an everyday guy. Their struggles were our struggles. You just never want it to end in murder.”
The murderer’s family’s conduct stuck in our Aussie throats. GBC dug his grave partly due to his conduct following the “disappearance”, and partly when he took the stand. When the BC Sr and family took the stand, they dug the rest of it for him.
But what does this really mean, what did the trial expose, other than the defendant and the crime itself ?
Two things are clear to me as at this date.
Ok, GBC is a narcissist. That is obvious, evidenced. But he was not hatched on the fourth moon of Jupiter. He did not create narcissism, secretly, in a bottle, in his bedroom, after his parents went to sleep. He was raised in a family. The Baden-Clays. And their conduct is telling, evidenced. They are all a bunch of disgusting liars, only interested in themselves, narcissists.
Second, as evidenced, they are:
(a) in denial of the blatantly obvious physical facts, and
(b) the level of their denial is pathological.
Such a level of denial is not achieved easily. It is achieved by long and consistent work, over many years, it has to instilled in children over decades.
They came across just the same as the Pistorius family, who wept at the histrionics of their precious income-earner, but were blind to fact that it is histrionics, evidence of mental disease, narcissism, sociopathy.
They came across the same as the Milat family. Seriously deranged and damaged. Seriously damaging their young. Milat’s nephew was recently convicted for an axe murder, committed in the very same Belanglo State Forest.
The point is, it is ingrained, familial, hereditary. (And if you consider certain races, due to their – as evidenced – disproportionate representations in certain criminality, genetic. But let’s not get distracted.)
They have shamed and humiliated themselves, by their very own actions.
They have piled shame and dishonour on the great and honourable name of Lord Baden-Powell. As a Boy Scout from 7 to 15, and a scout leader from 15 to 22, I am appalled, angry.
Of course, they too, had each reserved their special place in hell, long before the murder, but as of the trial, they have paid for their reservations in full. And for harming the honour of Baden-Powell, of the brotherhood of scouts, they will get one of the VIP boxes at no extra charge.
If any reporter or investigator is interested, Baden-Clay Sr’s affairs are worth sticky beak. Livvie’s liaisons will leave you livid.
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love youe posts, 👌👍
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Wow, Incisiveone — nice post
But the real kicker is that concluding sentence, quote: * Baden-Clay Sr’s affairs are worth sticky beak. Livvie’s liaisons will leave you livid*
Couple of weeks ago, I ventured a guess that OW’s marriage wouldn’t last long after the trial, regardless of whichever way it went. Time will tell
Anyway, great post 🙂
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Quote
They have piled shame and dishonour on the great and honourable name of Lord Baden-Powell. As a Boy Scout from 7 to 15, and a scout leader from 15 to 22, I am appalled, angry.
Unquote
Lord Baden-Powell was not an honourable man. He was a pedophile. His brow beaten wife was purportedly selected for her weak character so as to to be complicit in his crimes!
Mountbatten was one o his contemporaries upon his eventual return to the U.K.
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Jane. I hope you have some evidence of what you say to share. What a terrible thing it would be if a great war hero was defamed especially given that he is unable to defend himself. I hope these assertions about Lord Baden-Powell being a pedophile are able to be backed up by proven and documented evidence from some court somewhere. Could you please direct me to this evidence – real evidence (I don’t deal with hearsay/rumour/lies, sorry ) so that I can satisfy myself what you say is true.
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In response to the issue regarding the weight of circumstantial evidence, which several posters have raised, I offer two points.
“To bring in a verdict of guilty … guilt should not only be a rational inference, it must be the only rational inference that could be drawn from the circumstances,” Justice Byrne said.
The QPS, after all their investigation, have not identified any other suspect or anyone who has a motive in seeking Allison’s death.
Hearty congratulations to the QPS, AG, DPP, CIB, and our government servants who supported them.
Now Allison can rest in peace.
Blessings to the Dickie family.
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Coming to this late I can only add one little bit of information.
The Prosecution must lay out the facts of the case, not ‘their case’, just the facts of the matter. They cannot hide evidence that may acquit, it must also be included. That is why the prosecution led with the ‘scream’ evidence from witnesses, including evidence that suggested the screams may not have come from the alleged crime scene. The Prosecution may have had evidence of his car (‘Snowy’ IIRC) at the Kenmore roundabout, but it is also reported as inconclusive so they did not seek to present it (and Justice Applegarth who heard the evidentiary hearings may have excluded it anyway).
On balance, a scant look at the proceedings leaves you feeling the case was not made.
I’ve spent the last few days reading through the publicly available reports from the court and to me, the case was made and the jury returned the right verdict.
The Police correctly spotted something wrong when they attended the missing persons event and cleverly (and sensitively) took it from there. Kudos to the QLD Police for bringing the Crown a case worthy of hearing.
In the long term the Dickie’s still have a horrendous weight to carry, but it is something.
At least GBC won’t need to go looking for sex for the next few years. I suspect it will be coming to him!
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So much for the Baden-Clay name… Olivia Walton (nee Olivia Baden-Clay) then Olivia Baden-Walton is “Olivia Isobel” on Facebook!!
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Isobel is her Middle Name, so it appears she is trying to distance herself from both the Baden-Clay and Walton Names.
It would be interesting to learn whether she accepts the Verdict on Big Brother, and if she has chosen to visit him in Prison,.
Oh, the shame of it all !
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Thanks for all the Likes and comments on my posts. This site is so slow, I can’t post that on each and every post that acknowledged me, sorry.
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http://www.goldcoastbulletin.com.au/…-1227016623984
Corridors of Power: Hot gossip on Queensland politics, law, business, celebrity,
The Courier Mail, August 07, 2014.
It is a well respected tenet of Queensland Law that everyone deserves the right to a fair trial to ensure justice is done, and seen to be done.
“No one can argue Baden-Clay didn’t have the best representation available” … “the community can sleep well in the knowledge Baden-Clay is behind bars despite a robust defence”. …
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